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Thread: American Health Care

  1. #21
    Join Date
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    Falmouth of the Mighty BlueGrass State and Commonwealth of Kentucky
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    Default Re: American Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by JordyVerrill View Post
    I get my insurance from Medical Mutual. I had 90% of my deductible written off by the hospital (I had to have a few expensive tests done) because I have a low income. Get tests done at the hospital instead of private offices and you won't have to pay your deductible if you have low income.

    I have a family of 4 and we live off of $29,000 a year, BTW.
    Medical Mutual, got it and muchos appreciate it, thanks ever so much!

  2. #22
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    Jul 2012
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    London ontario area
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    Default Re: American Health Care

    I feel I must point out the flaws in our health care, because they are there. Equal health care for all also includes long wait times. Depending on what city you live in you can wait weeks or months for certain tests such as MRI. You are not allowed to pay for services. People wait a year or more for certain operations. There are also people who are above the system such as athletes and politicians..they don't wait for anything. People who are rich, go to the states to have their tests/operations to avoid our lists. Doctors don't wait because they know other doctors who put them ahead of everyone else. It's frustrating as a middle class person who can't afford to cross the border and pay for services but who might pay a little extra to be put on a shorter list. We are all equal unless we are rich..then, not so much!

  3. #23
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    Aug 2006
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    Kansas City
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    Default Re: American Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Todash View Post
    Those who don't have insurance are in a precarious position. Those who do are mostly fine--as long as they don't ever actually need it for more than routine health care.
    Dang. I just realize this means we're all screwed if we get really sick. Well, poop.

  4. #24
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    Jun 2007
    Location
    Cambridge, Ohio
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    17,667

    Default Re: American Health Care

    Well, poop.
    ...that'll be $195, with $100 going toward your deductible....

  5. #25
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    Default Re: American Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Mary19 View Post
    I feel I must point out the flaws in our health care, because they are there. Equal health care for all also includes long wait times. Depending on what city you live in you can wait weeks or months for certain tests such as MRI. You are not allowed to pay for services. People wait a year or more for certain operations. There are also people who are above the system such as athletes and politicians..they don't wait for anything. People who are rich, go to the states to have their tests/operations to avoid our lists. Doctors don't wait because they know other doctors who put them ahead of everyone else. It's frustrating as a middle class person who can't afford to cross the border and pay for services but who might pay a little extra to be put on a shorter list. We are all equal unless we are rich..then, not so much!
    Indeed, money does confer some privilege, as really it should. What's the point of earning it if it doesn't? I mean, as long as they are not burdening the Canadian health care system, it's one of those things you can file under "life isn't fair," I guess. And I really think you could make an argument for doctors getting treated first if it helps them to continue providing care themselves.

    So now I have to ask you: how does your system work? I imagine there has to be some sort of "triage" that goes on, right? So if you show up at the emergency room with a burst appendix, they don't just put you on a waiting list ... I hope.

  6. #26
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    Jan 2013
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    Default Re: American Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Todash View Post
    So now I have to ask you: how does your system work? I imagine there has to be some sort of "triage" that goes on, right? So if you show up at the emergency room with a burst appendix, they don't just put you on a waiting list ... I hope.
    You know, frankly, our current system of health care continues to rival that of the United Arab Emirates (UAE), who likely operate the best-funded national health strategy imaginable (it helps to have a strong petroeconomy). It easily surpasses the UK's faltering system, and compares favorably to the health care systems of other "socialist" countries such as Cuba, Nicaragua, China, Sweden and Norway.

    The greatest issue Canada's healthcare system is facing is continual de-funding by Conservative-leaning governments who continue to believe (without any evidence to actually back up this belief) that free-market systems of healthcare delivery are more cost efficient than publically-funded systems. To demonstrate the outcome of this belief in action, I'll briefly mention what's recently occurred in Alberta.

    Until fairly recently, Alberta's economy was floating in petrodollars, and through the 80's and 90's, the government had embarked on an ambitious plan to have full service hospitals offering 24/7 Emergency services in practically every community. It was amazing to see these small but state-of-art hospitals pop up everywhere, seeming overnight. And for this, most Albertans were charged a monthly insurance fee that was about $30 per person (subsidies were available to those individuals and families that could not afford this fee). This fee gradually increased to $44 per month per person, but in January 2009 it was entirely eliminated: Albertans would now pay nothing; the Province could afford this... or so the Premier of the Province, Ed Stelmach, led people to believe.

    Predictably net costs began to increase; when the price of oil dropped, net costs increased dramatically. Typical of Conservative thinking, these costs were held up as evidence of the indicative of the inefficiency of socialized medicine, and now there's some discussion of integrating "user pay for certain services" (i.e., where private for profit medical service corporations - many of them American - could make a go of it). Costs will predicatably continue to increase... as they did when other publically owned and operated services and utilities were privatized (from AGT to energy ultilities, the government insistented services would improve and consumer costs would decrease as free-market competition would increase. In actual fact, the opposite occurred).

    I'd like to point out, however, that worlds first system of socialized medicine was established in the early 1920s by the former Soviet Union. Like most things in the Soviet Union, it soon fell apart. Whereas the Canada's current system demonstrates that socialized medicine can coexist within a free-market economy, the dismal failure of Soviet medicine demonstrated how corruption within any society can distort any system. And you'd think, with the recent revelations about how big pharma is deliberately manipulating the costs of drugs, people would've caught unto this. But they apparently haven't.

    Further, while we all hear annecdotes about how Canada's system failed on this and that occasion, we rarely hear hear about the tens of millions of times annually wherein the system did what it was designed to do: deliver access to the world's best health care to each and every Canadian.

    Me, I dread what's coming in the future - every day that a Conservative government is allowed to effect its foolish, self-destructive ideology is another day that brings the failure - if not the complete and utter collapse - of Canada's healthcare system that much closer to reality.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: American Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Amphiaraus View Post
    ... (from AGT to energy ultilities, the government insistented services would improve and consumer costs would decrease as free-market competition would increase. In actual fact, the opposite occurred).
    "insistented" <==== what the hell word is that?

    *sighs*

    That sentence ought to read, "(from AGT to energy ultilities, the government *insisted* services would improve and costs to consumers would decrease as free-market competition would increase. In actual fact, the opposite occurred)."

    This time I'll not blame my iPhone for the dozen or so curious lapses contained within my previous post; instead, I'll pin the blame on Eric the Wonder Moose, the typist I've recently hired to handle my e-mails and general correspondence. For those curious, yes, Eric is a moose. He has antlers, and you'd be surprised at how many words per minute Eric can type out...


    True those words are often questionable efforts such as 'insistented', 'operantsdnt' and 'antidisestablishmentarianism'.... (and let's not even discuss Eric's questionable punctuation, word duplications, word skips and frequent lapses in tense and grammer... not to mention the use of "it's" when its not correct)... but I think readers, generally, get the idea of what me and Eric are going on about. If not, there's always much hilarity to be found in discovering yet another on-line fail

    (Next up, watch me and Eric in a hilarious new YouTube video wherein we attempt moose-enabled paragliding and prove once and for all that a moose's antlers can - or maybe cannot - defy gravity...)

  8. #28
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    Default Re: American Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Amphiaraus View Post
    I'd like to point out, however, that world's first system of socialized medicine was established in the early 1920s by the former Soviet Union. Like most things in the Soviet Union, it soon fell apart. Whereas the Canada's current system demonstrates that socialized medicine can coexist within a free-market economy, the dismal failure of Soviet medicine demonstrated how corruption within any society can distort any system. And you'd think, with the recent revelations about how big pharma is deliberately manipulating the costs of drugs, people would've caught unto this. But they apparently haven't.
    Right you are. No system works unless people make it happen. But there's no way private markets reduce overall costs. I guarantee that if Canada goes to a "buy your own" healthcare system, people not used to paying the hundreds of dollars to make that happen simply won't be able to rapidly adjust, sending insurance costs skyrocketing.

    The thing is ... however much people bitch about the government (like it's somehow drawn from a pool populated by a different species of semi-intelligent bipeds, not by people just like the rest of us), there are all kinds of hidden costs in the free market health care system that are there in part because of the inefficiencies caused by said system.

    1. Someone has to pay for the people who cannot, e.g., my husband's younger sister who has gone to the ER at least three times because of migraines, despite the fact that she can usually head hers off with ibuprofen. Any known cost is much more easily controlled for.
    2. Doctors' offices, hospitals, etc., have people specifically devoted to billing because it's all a nightmare. Every insurance company has different rules, different coverages, etc., and that adds HUGE inefficiencies into the system.
    3. Doctors hampered by insurance company constraints, making health care choices based on, not their experience and observation, but what an insurance company requires.

  9. #29
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    Kansas City
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    Default Re: American Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Amphiaraus View Post

    (Next up, watch me and Eric in a hilarious new YouTube video wherein we attempt moose-enabled paragliding and prove once and for all that a moose's antlers can - or maybe cannot - defy gravity...)
    So. I guess up there in the Great White North, you get gubmint wacky tobacky instead of gubmint cheese?

  10. #30
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    Apr 2008
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    120 miles S of the Waffle/Pancake line in pancake territory
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    Default Re: American Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Todash View Post
    Right you are. No system works unless people make it happen. But there's no way private markets reduce overall costs. I guarantee that if Canada goes to a "buy your own" healthcare system, people not used to paying the hundreds of dollars to make that happen simply won't be able to rapidly adjust, sending insurance costs skyrocketing.

    The thing is ... however much people bitch about the government (like it's somehow drawn from a pool populated by a different species of semi-intelligent bipeds, not by people just like the rest of us), there are all kinds of hidden costs in the free market health care system that are there in part because of the inefficiencies caused by said system.

    1. Someone has to pay for the people who cannot, e.g., my husband's younger sister who has gone to the ER at least three times because of migraines, despite the fact that she can usually head hers off with ibuprofen. Any known cost is much more easily controlled for.
    2. Doctors' offices, hospitals, etc., have people specifically devoted to billing because it's all a nightmare. Every insurance company has different rules, different coverages, etc., and that adds HUGE inefficiencies into the system.
    3. Doctors hampered by insurance company constraints, making health care choices based on, not their experience and observation, but what an insurance company requires.
    As to your point #2, I've had this idea that the government should write a plan and make all the insurance companies handle the exact same plan (lets call it plan A). Now I'm a free market guy so the companies can charge whatever they want for plan A and they can offer all the other plans they want but every company has to offer Plan A and it is the exact same plan no matter what company you use. Buying insurance is so confusing and if there was a Plan A, it would at least be a good starting point and a way to compare companies. The way it is now it is impossible to compare rate between companies because no two plans are the same.

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