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Jesus painting banned in school.......... - Page 3

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Thread: Jesus painting banned in school..........

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    Quote Originally Posted by Shasta View Post
    Well, presidents, MLK Jr, bunnies, and dogs actually exist.
    ...the Son of God existed in some way, shape or form as well....and I lean toward the agnostic....

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Gray View Post
    I didn't call you a liar. I said you are being dishonest. There is a difference. I give you the benefit of the doubt that you weren't following through with the logic, nor considering your own bias when you formulated the statement. A liar actively is trying to deceive. I think you were being dishonest to both us and yourself. Let's throw a big huge SPOTLIGHT on your inconsistency in just the last few posts....

    1. You try to say the picture should stay there... it's art... taking it down is censorship.
    2. You now seem all for censorship, and even go so far as to list the things you think should be censored.

    I think you are good person. I just don't think you are being a fair person or honest with yourself. You see Jesus as good, thus you don't see the harm. If it is good for you, it is good for other people. Problem solved. The issue is that public schools are full of people who don't share your beliefs. The public schools should not become a culture war. The poor students who attend them should not be placed in the middle. Since it is impossible to put everyone's icon up, it is better not to put any of them up. Since we both agree that you are a good person, I think you will have to concede the inconsistency of your argument?
    I'll say this, then we can shake hands and have a beer. I can see your point. Censorship is a slippery slope indeed. If the picture was used as a teaching device, or if the kids were forced to pray at the foot of the picture, then yeah, it should be gone. But that wasn't the case. To me its akin to someone saying that they don't believe in white paint, so the halls of the schools have to be repainted. It just seems silly to me. We can at least agree to disagree.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuggs View Post
    I'll say this, then we can shake hands and have a beer. I can see your point. Censorship is a slippery slope indeed.
    The most slippery in fact. Human beings, in general, find it near impossible to see beyond their own bias and thus are blind to their own censorship even if they hate censorship with a passion. Deconstruction Theory talks about it at length.

    If the picture was used as a teaching device, or if the kids were forced to pray at the foot of the picture, then yeah, it should be gone. But that wasn't the case. To me its akin to someone saying that they don't believe in white paint, so the halls of the schools have to be repainted. It just seems silly to me. We can at least agree to disagree.
    I will say that I seriously doubt any students were ever made to pray at the foot of the picture. I suspect, over the years, many a student has been told to stand there and look at Jesus when they have been naughty. This was done at my OWN school quite frequently. It was very effective on Christian students. I always wondered what non-Christians were thinking and how insulting it was to them. Religious symbols (and a picture of Christ is certainly one of them) come with a lot of baggage. You and I will have to agree to disagree. They aren't the same as a white wall of paint. They make a statement. I share the original poster's curiosity about a group who had nothing better to do than go out of their way to fight the battle to remove the picture. I do think there are probably better ways to spend such energy, but I cannot disagree with the fact it didn't belong there. The only thing that bothers me is that the School itself hadn't removed it a long time ago without being prompted.

    The world has moved on. We are a very big country with countless beliefs and many of them seem mutually exclusive. It is "white noise" as far as I'm concerned and nothing but a distraction from what schools are supposed to do. Let the culture war rage all it wants to, but OUTSIDE the schools as much as possible. We can shake hands if we ever meet and you can have a beer and I'll stick to the Diet Dr. Pepper. To each their own poison.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    Personally I'd have to applaud the respect the two recent posters have shown one-another in their debating. Does a heart good to see this! (Thank you)
    ~ There'll be Chocolate, if God wills it. ~

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Gray View Post
    The most slippery in fact. Human beings, in general, find it near impossible to see beyond their own bias and thus are blind to their own censorship even if they hate censorship with a passion. Deconstruction Theory talks about it at length.



    I will say that I seriously doubt any students were ever made to pray at the foot of the picture. I suspect, over the years, many a student has been told to stand there and look at Jesus when they have been naughty. This was done at my OWN school quite frequently. It was very effective on Christian students. I always wondered what non-Christians were thinking and how insulting it was to them. Religious symbols (and a picture of Christ is certainly one of them) come with a lot of baggage. You and I will have to agree to disagree. They aren't the same as a white wall of paint. They make a statement. I share the original poster's curiosity about a group who had nothing better to do than go out of their way to fight the battle to remove the picture. I do think there are probably better ways to spend such energy, but I cannot disagree with the fact it didn't belong there. The only thing that bothers me is that the School itself hadn't removed it a long time ago without being prompted.

    The world has moved on. We are a very big country with countless beliefs and many of them seem mutually exclusive. It is "white noise" as far as I'm concerned and nothing but a distraction from what schools are supposed to do. Let the culture war rage all it wants to, but OUTSIDE the schools as much as possible. We can shake hands if we ever meet and you can have a beer and I'll stick to the Diet Dr. Pepper. To each their own poison.
    Not too much of beer guy either, so Diet Dr. Pepper it is!

  6. #26
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    What about the great works of art? I am sure that, especially in Europe, there are a lot of folks who do not believe...it is their choice. Should the works of Leonardo or DaVinci be removed because of their religious nature. I am sure there are many public learning establishments with artforms of a religious nature inside them. Who decides if they are there because of faith or because of art?
    Like I said earlier, it is a public school, I do not care about the actual painting....it could have been a Star of David....same thing. This picture was there for a very long time and everybody lived with it. I imagine most of the student body and the parent body couldn't give a good gol darn. I am wondering where it is going to stop? I know a lot of agnostics and atheists who are very smart people. This is something they would not waste their time over.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    Quote Originally Posted by FlakeNoir View Post
    Personally I'd have to applaud the respect the two recent posters have shown one-another in their debating. Does a heart good to see this! (Thank you)
    You're welcome. But I'd say more credit goes to Robert Gray. He kept his head a bit better than I. That said, we should all strive to talk peaceably to one another. Respect is a good thing. Our politicians would do well to learn that. To Robert Gray, thank you for the chat. You made me look inside myself a bit, and that's always a good thing.

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    Quote Originally Posted by staropeace View Post
    What about the great works of art? I am sure that, especially in Europe, there are a lot of folks who do not believe...it is their choice. Should the works of Leonardo or DaVinci be removed because of their religious nature. I am sure there are many public learning establishments with artforms of a religious nature inside them. Who decides if they are there because of faith or because of art?
    Like I said earlier, it is a public school, I do not care about the actual painting....it could have been a Star of David....same thing. This picture was there for a very long time and everybody lived with it. I imagine most of the student body and the parent body couldn't give a good gol darn. I am wondering where it is going to stop? I know a lot of agnostics and atheists who are very smart people. This is something they would not waste their time over.
    I agree.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuggs View Post
    Whether or not you are a Christian or believe in God, you cannot deny that Jesus was a real person.
    Sure I can. There's not any extra-Biblical evidence that Jesus ever actually lived.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Jesus painting banned in school..........

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Gray View Post
    The picture didn't belong there for a variety of different reasons, not the least of which is a school is there to teach you how to read, write, and count beyond your fingers and toes. Religious instruction is for your parents. That aside, the picture hanging there would say to every non-Christian that they are second class students because their articles of faith aren't also displayed. I'm not anti-Christian. I'm not anti-anything. I just don't think public schools are the place for religious icons. They have enough to worry about without having to tackle that subject too.
    That's an awful lot of art to throw out of our public schools. Half of the masterpieces since the dark ages were designed to go into cathedrals, obvious religious iconography, and no good is served by removing copies of them, so long as they're there as art, and as long as there is also a decent mix of non-religious artwork.

    Maybe you were made to ponder your sins beneath some painted Jesus, but even in my rural, hardcore-conservative, ultra-religious hometown, that sort of thing would never have been permitted. I have strong doubts that such a thing happened outside of isolated incidents, at least not since the 50s.

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