Lisbeth Returns

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FlakeNoir

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By the way... My brothers wife is angry at Stieg Larsson. Says he was the founder of this scandinavian noir movement and that it paints scandinavia as a much darker place than it really is with widespread corruption in every level and corpses popping up as soon you go to the store. Tried to calm her by saying he wasn't exactly first that these dark crime books has been around for years in many countries but no success. Stieg Larsson is to blame for making the whole world think scandinavia is a really rotten place. A slight overreaction i thought. (she loves Agatha christie)
Tell her, I just thought he wrote a good tale... :)
 

Kurben

The Fool on the Hill
Apr 12, 2014
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Tell her, I just thought he wrote a good tale... :)
It is one of those subjects i tend to avoid. She has a full sermon prepared. Really steamed up about it. And she only read the first book...... Didn't like it so skipped the next two. But i agree with her in thinking that it got a bit more praise than it deserved. It is good but it isn't the great book (or trilogy) that it sometimes is portrayed as. Lisbeth is great but the journalist, Blomkvist, is nothing special.
 

FlakeNoir

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It is one of those subjects i tend to avoid. She has a full sermon prepared. Really steamed up about it. And she only read the first book...... Didn't like it so skipped the next two. But i agree with her in thinking that it got a bit more praise than it deserved. It is good but it isn't the great book (or trilogy) that it sometimes is portrayed as. Lisbeth is great but the journalist, Blomkvist, is nothing special.
I see... best to avoid it then. :)
& I agree... the characters kept me there for the story, I had thought at first that it might be a translation issue, but remember you saying earlier that there was a bit more to it than that.
I think it became poplar because the right people noticed it. (think: 50 Shades and that sparkly vampire crap... though, he probably doesn't actually deserve to be put in quite that category, he was better than that.)
 

Kurben

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I see... best to avoid it then. :)
& I agree... the characters kept me there for the story, I had thought at first that it might be a translation issue, but remember you saying earlier that there was a bit more to it than that.
I think it became poplar because the right people noticed it. (think: 50 Shades and that sparkly vampire crap... though, he probably doesn't actually deserve to be put in quite that category, he was better than that.)
Yes, he was. I think it is Lisbeth, she was a novelty then in the crimeworld and she is the best character in the trilogy. Not that she is a hacker but her whole situation and how she deals with it. Without her they wouldn't be what they are. (and i don't want to hear any more comparisons to that twilight crap, they are much better than that. You hear me Flake!!)) =D=D=D
 

FlakeNoir

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Yes, he was. I think it is Lisbeth, she was a novelty then in the crimeworld and she is the best character in the trilogy. Not that she is a hacker but her whole situation and how she deals with it. Without her they wouldn't be what they are. (and i don't want to hear any more comparisons to that twilight crap, they are much better than that. You hear me Flake!!)) =D=D=D
Oh you saw that didja? ;;D

Lisbeth is great, he definitely got it right when he dug her up from the earth.
 

morgan

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Jul 11, 2010
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I've only read The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo - don't know if I will continue with the series. I tend not to read books finished by another writer after the original author has passed away. Too depressing. I couldn't read Michael Crichton's last novel for that reason.
 

Kurben

The Fool on the Hill
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I've only read The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo - don't know if I will continue with the series. I tend not to read books finished by another writer after the original author has passed away. Too depressing. I couldn't read Michael Crichton's last novel for that reason.
The first three is completely written by him. He died before they were released but they wwere finished. He was never really a writer and doubted for a long time if he should publish. He was an investigative journalist specialised in hate and racism issues. Especially nazi and other very rightwing groups. Founded a newspaper that he published in. Expo. Millennium is probably inspired by his work there.
 

Kurben

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Kurben, is your sister-in-law aware of the books written by Sjöwall and Wahlöö? If there are any books that picture a dark Sweden (granted, quite some years have passed, but still) it's those!
Her arguments in that case (and i brought up both them and Henning Mankell) was that they did not try in the same way to paint it as realistic or at least not as realistic as the recent scandinavian noir books do. I guess thats why she prefers agatha christie and others because these books centers around the mystery of the crime, not the dark society the crime is committed in. She doesn't agree with the trend of crime books as a way to air ones critique of society especially when it seems to be the main goal for the book. The mystery is really in the second or third place. I agree it is a point (i mean in the first Salander book it is not very difficult to figure out that Harriet probably got out from the island and how) but she doesn't buy my argument that many books in the crime genre today you know fairly early who the culprit is or how the mystery is formed. That it is not the answer that the book is about but the way to the answer. Just as in Tolkien we are fairly certain that the good will triumph in the end. The questiuon is more of how they'll do it than if.

But it is ok. I recommend her books that are more mystery oriented than society oriented like Philip MacDonald, John Dickson Carr, Ross MacDonald and Ellery queen. Never talents could be some of, just some of, Peter Robinsons books or Denise Mina. But she usually likes my recommendations. I recommended David Morells Murder is a Fine Art to her earlier today.
 

Kurben

The Fool on the Hill
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All three books were a tad bloated and flawed but it was Lisbeth who made me return each time.
Agree that all three have flaws, esoecially the second which is the least impressive as it is mainly a build up for the third which is, I think, the best of them. But they are all too long and could have needed a bit of trimming. They are not great but thanks to Lisbeth they are good.
 

@PM

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I'm not quite sure I agree, Sjöwall and Wahlöö definitely also painted a certain picture. How realistic it is (or was, at the time) I can't say of course, born well after the timeframe the books were written and in a different country. And if you'd like your crime novels without too much political influence then Agatha Christie is definitely a good choice ;) (although some became political as time passed, like Ten Little *******)

Edit: hmm I can't even put a book title up here without it being starred away.... :) I was talking about the original title of And Then There Were None.
 

Kurben

The Fool on the Hill
Apr 12, 2014
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I'm not quite sure I agree, Sjöwall and Wahlöö definitely also painted a certain picture. How realistic it is (or was, at the time) I can't say of course, born well after the timeframe the books were written and in a different country. And if you'd like your crime novels without too much political influence then Agatha Christie is definitely a good choice ;) (although some became political as time passed, like Ten Little *******)

Edit: hmm I can't even put a book title up here without it being starred away.... :) I was talking about the original title of And Then There Were None.
Oh, I agree with you that Sjöwall Wahlöö was in the same vain, just better written. And the last were terribly politic, Like The Terrorists or The Policemurderer, They were at their best in the middle of their series with The Laughing Policeman or The Firewagon that Disappeared. The longer the series wore on the more political they tended to get. It was wise of them to drop it after the 10,th book.
 

kingricefan

All-being, keeper of Space, Time & Dimension.
Jul 11, 2006
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Yes, he was. I think it is Lisbeth, she was a novelty then in the crimeworld and she is the best character in the trilogy. Not that she is a hacker but her whole situation and how she deals with it. Without her they wouldn't be what they are. (and i don't want to hear any more comparisons to that twilight crap, they are much better than that. You hear me Flake!!)) =D=D=D
Lisbeth was the most refreshing fictional character to come along in a very long time. She is a bottomless well- just when you think you know her, her thoughts and how she's going to react to a situation, she just goes off on a different angle. She's what I call an 'onion'- peel off one layer and there's another beneath, and another, and another, etc. I think also what adds to the appeal to the books is that so many have come to love Lisbeth, want to protect her, want to see her become a fuller person, want to see her happy. It's a shame that we will really never know how Larsson was going to write her story thru the (supposedly) 8 more books that he had planned. I don't know, for me maybe it's because I saw Lisbeth as a modern day version of Carrie? Lisbeth lives with the same oppression and fear that Carrie lived with on a day-to-day basis. Yes, Lisbeth is more resilient than Carrie ever was, but she lives with the same broken heart and the knowledge that she really will never fit in anywhere or with anyone. Like Carrie, Lisbeth is broken inside by her years of abuse at the hands of her family but also at the hands of the law that is supposedly there to help her. And yet she still has hope......
 

Kurben

The Fool on the Hill
Apr 12, 2014
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sweden
Lisbeth was the most refreshing fictional character to come along in a very long time. She is a bottomless well- just when you think you know her, her thoughts and how she's going to react to a situation, she just goes off on a different angle. She's what I call an 'onion'- peel off one layer and there's another beneath, and another, and another, etc. I think also what adds to the appeal to the books is that so many have come to love Lisbeth, want to protect her, want to see her become a fuller person, want to see her happy. It's a shame that we will really never know how Larsson was going to write her story thru the (supposedly) 8 more books that he had planned. I don't know, for me maybe it's because I saw Lisbeth as a modern day version of Carrie? Lisbeth lives with the same oppression and fear that Carrie lived with on a day-to-day basis. Yes, Lisbeth is more resilient than Carrie ever was, but she lives with the same broken heart and the knowledge that she really will never fit in anywhere or with anyone. Like Carrie, Lisbeth is broken inside by her years of abuse at the hands of her family but also at the hands of the law that is supposedly there to help her. And yet she still has hope......
One thing that makes me a bit wary about this fourth instalment is that it is totally Lagerkrantz book. It does not build upon notes or chapters that Larsson had written and left behind. Larssons widow is angry about it. Says that it is just a scheme from the bookcompany and the father/brother team to squeeze out as much money as possible from a body long dead. Says that the choice of Lagercrantz is un explicable because he did not know Larsson, Had nothing in common with him and their background is also very different. How could he possibly write a book like Larsson did? Thats her argument. She also says that if this Lagercrantz is so good in writing why not give him a contract and let him write his own book? She points out that he has never written a prose novel before, just biographies and interviewbooks. The other side does not say anything which perhaps is wise because she does have a point.
 

kingricefan

All-being, keeper of Space, Time & Dimension.
Jul 11, 2006
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Spokane, WA
One thing that makes me a bit wary about this fourth instalment is that it is totally Lagerkrantz book. It does not build upon notes or chapters that Larsson had written and left behind. Larssons widow is angry about it. Says that it is just a scheme from the bookcompany and the father/brother team to squeeze out as much money as possible from a body long dead. Says that the choice of Lagercrantz is un explicable because he did not know Larsson, Had nothing in common with him and their background is also very different. How could he possibly write a book like Larsson did? Thats her argument. She also says that if this Lagercrantz is so good in writing why not give him a contract and let him write his own book? She points out that he has never written a prose novel before, just biographies and interviewbooks. The other side does not say anything which perhaps is wise because she does have a point.
One more reason for me NOT to purchase and read this book then. I do not want my vision of Lisbeth or Blomkvist being ruined by someone who has no idea what those two characters are all about. It's probably going to be turned into some type of hard core S&M novel ala Fifty Shades Of Grey..........:barf:
 
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Kurben

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One more reason for me NOT to purchase and read this book then. I do not want my vision of Lisbeth or Blomkvist being ruined by someone who has no idea what those two characters are all about. It's probably going to be turned into some type of hard core S&M novel ala Fifty Shades Of Grey..........:barf:
I doubt that it will be that bad..... But i'm worried. I'll keep you updated.
 

FlakeNoir

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Apr 11, 2006
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One thing that makes me a bit wary about this fourth instalment is that it is totally Lagerkrantz book. It does not build upon notes or chapters that Larsson had written and left behind. Larssons widow is angry about it. Says that it is just a scheme from the bookcompany and the father/brother team to squeeze out as much money as possible from a body long dead. Says that the choice of Lagercrantz is un explicable because he did not know Larsson, Had nothing in common with him and their background is also very different. How could he possibly write a book like Larsson did? Thats her argument. She also says that if this Lagercrantz is so good in writing why not give him a contract and let him write his own book? She points out that he has never written a prose novel before, just biographies and interviewbooks. The other side does not say anything which perhaps is wise because she does have a point.
Oh, I didn't realise that... hmmm, this makes a big difference.
 

skimom2

Just moseyin' through...
Oct 9, 2013
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It is one of those subjects i tend to avoid. She has a full sermon prepared. Really steamed up about it. And she only read the first book...... Didn't like it so skipped the next two. But i agree with her in thinking that it got a bit more praise than it deserved. It is good but it isn't the great book (or trilogy) that it sometimes is portrayed as. Lisbeth is great but the journalist, Blomkvist, is nothing special.
For some reason, I really liked Blomqvist in the original Swedish movie. The actor made him MORE than he was in the book--humanized him, maybe? He fas more 'flat' in the book. Craig was all right in the US remake, but the Swedish actor (can't remember his name) was better.