Word Count. What Keeps You Going?

[Donald Miller]

In his book, "On Writing," Stephen suggests writing 2,000 words a day. I enjoy writing, now that I've rekindled my interest in becoming at least a competent writer. I'm competent enough -- as a writer -- to enjoy my own writing.

I never seriously considered setting a word count goal before, preferring the Conradian approach of writing what came to me, as it came. For Joseph Conrad that was as little as three or four words in an eight hour day -- words which he erased before he went to bed. It's difficult to argue with success. Conrad didn't always have those days. He has a solid body of outstanding writing as his legacy.

He was not very popular during his own day, except among fellow writers. And today, with the exception of a few books, "Heart of Darkness" being the most popular, many of his works are overlooked.

That much we know about a great writer. For what do we mere artisans hope?

From the book, "How do I get to Carnegie Hall?" one man asked. "Practice, practice, practice," the other man answered.

Anyway, this discussion is about writing goals for those who have that inclination and do it mostly for enjoyment, with monetary considerations being a distant second.

 

[stevegane]

My first novel took seven weeks and three days to write about 96000 words, I had it critiqued and was advised to take out about 25000 words. It has taken about 5 months to get it sorted and edited nearly finished now.

 

[Donald Miller]

My first novel took seven weeks and three days to write about 96000 words, I had it critiqued and was advised to take out about 25000 words. It has taken about 5 months to get it sorted and edited nearly finished now.

Was was your daily word count set at? Was it easier or tougher to right the book than you thought it would be. What's your book about?

 

[Walter Oobleck]

I remember reading the Q&A at the back of The Story of Edgar Sawtelle, a story I enjoyed and the paperback I had I "loaned" to a customer who likes to read...customers...both of them like to read, a couple, plus they like dogs...and I never got it back not that I tried all that hard...they have a garage full of paperbacks, Ace, this, that, the other, and they said the door's unlocked...some great Conan stories in there...picked out a few Steinbeck...others. But the man who wrote The Story of Edgar Sawtelle...David Wroblewski...he's answering the questions put to him by another whose name I forget...talking about writing. Do not recall his exact words, but he said he is not disciplined...that he writes...sporadically. And I believe his story took some time start to finish.

There's all manner of anecdotal evidence to support all manner of claims, whichever one you want to hold dear to your heart. Harry Crews said or wrote somewhere that one should sit down every day, the same time, and even if you do not write, you sit there...he used more colorful language...and do that every day. I imagine that the more discipline and devotion you develop, the more determined you are, the more likely you are to see results. The guy in the honkey-tonk who runs the pool table on you didn't get to be that good by watching videos.

The last time I wrote for any extended period of time I made a note of my progress and that note is somewhere in the house, over in the cubby-hole under the stairwell I'm sure. Spinning my wheels. Be loud be somebody. Sounds like lyrics of a country song. I'm gonna be! Loud tonight! Somebody check my oil! Cause the engine light is on! Perhaps there is a danger in simply producing words to produce words....sorta like writing all night your hands wet on the wheel...no clue if the oil is okay...ignoring that wobble at higher speeds...that soft brake pedal...those people flashing their brights at you. Tail-gaters...why are they clueless? If we liken writing to tailgating...how does one get the message across? Larger print on the bumper sticker? Yosemite on the mud flaps? Spittle-spraying stomp on the brake pedal followed by that heart-stopping stomp on the gas?

 

[stevegane]

I never thought about or wanted to write a novel. I had a dream and just had to write the story, It's about Yardies, Black gangsters, some days I would write 4000 words some days 500 it varied from day to day. I found it easy.

 

[Grandpa]

Somewhere from 0 to 3,000 words at a stretch. When work and family calls, that's what takes precedence, and they call a lot.

The story I wrote that wowed friends and family was about 22,000 words, and I wrote it in fairly short order (you can take that both ways), over about two weeks, maybe a little more, in my spare time. It got a couple of close friends excited enough that they told me, do some character development, add more narrative, make it a real book, and it'll sell! I did what they said, made it more like 55,000 words, and in doing so sucked the life out of it. So it's back to 22,000-25,000 words, sitting around as a trophy to the endeavor of artistic self-fulfillment.

I generally know exactly where I want to end up with my story. The problem is getting there. Sometimes the narrative flows. Sometimes it doesn't. Positive attitude can be a problem. When work is going well, the assignments are pouring in, the patrons are happy and shelling out the money, then I'm busy, productive, happy, and feeling good enough that I'm motivated to write, which detracts from the work production, which then kinda spoils how good work is going, so I focus back on the work, and then the muse is chewing on my ear, telling me that the words are flowing, so pay attention to the story, dangit!

Ah, well. There are worse problems to have.

 

[DiO'Bolic]

I write about that every day. Not for any writing goals or monetary achievement, but mostly for personal enjoyment. I believe writing helps to keep the mind sharp and the imagination flowing.

(Although I do believe there are some here that prefer I wrote less. )

 

[Bryan James]

Sometimes I write.

 

[Donald Miller]

I remember reading the Q&A at the back of The Story of Edgar Sawtelle, a story I enjoyed and the paperback I had I "loaned" to a customer who likes to read...customers...both of them like to read, a couple, plus they like dogs...and I never got it back not that I tried all that hard...they have a garage full of paperbacks, Ace, this, that, the other, and they said the door's unlocked...some great Conan stories in there...picked out a few Steinbeck...others. But the man who wrote The Story of Edgar Sawtelle...David Wroblewski...he's answering the questions put to him by another whose name I forget...talking about writing. Do not recall his exact words, but he said he is not disciplined...that he writes...sporadically. And I believe his story took some time start to finish.

There's all manner of anecdotal evidence to support all manner of claims, whichever one you want to hold dear to your heart. Harry Crews said or wrote somewhere that one should sit down every day, the same time, and even if you do not write, you sit there...he used more colorful language...and do that every day. I imagine that the more discipline and devotion you develop, the more determined you are, the more likely you are to see results. The guy in the honkey-tonk who runs the pool table on you didn't get to be that good by watching videos.

The last time I wrote for any extended period of time I made a note of my progress and that note is somewhere in the house, over in the cubby-hole under the stairwell I'm sure. Spinning my wheels. Be loud be somebody. Sounds like lyrics of a country song. I'm gonna be! Loud tonight! Somebody check my oil! Cause the engine light is on! Perhaps there is a danger in simply producing words to produce words....sorta like writing all night your hands wet on the wheel...no clue if the oil is okay...ignoring that wobble at higher speeds...that soft brake pedal...those people flashing their brights at you. Tail-gaters...why are they clueless? If we liken writing to tailgating...how does one get the message across? Larger print on the bumper sticker? Yosemite on the mud flaps? Spittle-spraying stomp on the brake pedal followed by that heart-stopping stomp on the gas?

Joseph Conrad spent five years writing his first novel. After he gave up being a sailor, he wrote full time. His approach was as you stated, "I imagine that the more discipline and devotion you develop, the more determined you are, the more likely you are to see results." It worked for him.

 

[Donald Miller]

Sometimes I write.

Why "sometimes" and what do you write? Do you have any goals -- a short story or a novel -- that you are putting off?

 

[Donald Miller]

I write about that every day. Not for any writing goals or monetary achievement, but mostly for personal enjoyment. I believe writing helps to keep the mind sharp and the imagination flowing.

(Although I do believe there are some here that prefer I wrote less. )

I have decided to write for myself. It's much more reward, plus I've noticed that I write better. My role model is Joseph Conrad. I don't have the dedication or talent to write in his style, but I admire him immensely. His legacy is a remarkable body of work.
(But don't leave out the study of writing even though you're writing for yourself. If you leave that out, you'll have a far less likely chance of writing something you'll be proud of. My opinion, for what it's worth.)

 

[Donald Miller]

Somewhere from 0 to 3,000 words at a stretch. When work and family calls, that's what takes precedence, and they call a lot.

The story I wrote that wowed friends and family was about 22,000 words, and I wrote it in fairly short order (you can take that both ways), over about two weeks, maybe a little more, in my spare time. It got a couple of close friends excited enough that they told me, do some character development, add more narrative, make it a real book, and it'll sell! I did what they said, made it more like 55,000 words, and in doing so sucked the life out of it. So it's back to 22,000-25,000 words, sitting around as a trophy to the endeavor of artistic self-fulfillment.

I generally know exactly where I want to end up with my story. The problem is getting there. Sometimes the narrative flows. Sometimes it doesn't. Positive attitude can be a problem. When work is going well, the assignments are pouring in, the patrons are happy and shelling out the money, then I'm busy, productive, happy, and feeling good enough that I'm motivated to write, which detracts from the work production, which then kinda spoils how good work is going, so I focus back on the work, and then the muse is chewing on my ear, telling me that the words are flowing, so pay attention to the story, dangit!

Ah, well. There are worse problems to have.

I have had what you mentioned happen to me. You follow other people's advice and "Have the life sucked out of it." The trick is to know what advice to heed and which to ignore.

Do you write to get published or are you writing for the enjoyment of it? Or both?

 

[Donald Miller]

I never thought about or wanted to write a novel. I had a dream and just had to write the story, It's about Yardies, Black gangsters, some days I would write 4000 words some days 500 it varied from day to day. I found it easy.

Because everything I write is for free, and there is so much free material to read -- overwhelming actually, and I mean the challenge of reading the work of people I know, I don't pay to read. I'd be interested in reading your work if you ever decide to place it on line.

I know mostly amatuer writers. It's a challenge to read most of it-- I mean an ordeal-like challenge. An often grueling, wince-inducing challenge. But sometimes I come across work that is a real pleasure to read. I placed one woman's book on my site, My site being mentioned in the self promotion area, here. I don't really know the woman, but I was glad to do it. Her story is lovely, and I noticed that on Booksie, she got 13 reads in two months. Now that's a crime. She deserves much more than that.

 

[Donald Miller]

Somewhere from 0 to 3,000 words at a stretch. When work and family calls, that's what takes precedence, and they call a lot.

The story I wrote that wowed friends and family was about 22,000 words, and I wrote it in fairly short order (you can take that both ways), over about two weeks, maybe a little more, in my spare time. It got a couple of close friends excited enough that they told me, do some character development, add more narrative, make it a real book, and it'll sell! I did what they said, made it more like 55,000 words, and in doing so sucked the life out of it. So it's back to 22,000-25,000 words, sitting around as a trophy to the endeavor of artistic self-fulfillment.

I generally know exactly where I want to end up with my story. The problem is getting there. Sometimes the narrative flows. Sometimes it doesn't. Positive attitude can be a problem. When work is going well, the assignments are pouring in, the patrons are happy and shelling out the money, then I'm busy, productive, happy, and feeling good enough that I'm motivated to write, which detracts from the work production, which then kinda spoils how good work is going, so I focus back on the work, and then the muse is chewing on my ear, telling me that the words are flowing, so pay attention to the story, dangit!

Ah, well. There are worse problems to have.

Do you have your story online. Maybe I'll take a look.

 

[prufrock21]

One word then another.

Looks easy
When the final syllables
Just jell

 

[Demeter]

If I write 500 words a day I'm happy. if I write anything at all I'm happy, really. I try not to let the numbers get in the way.
I did NaNoWriMo last year. If you don't write at least 1.666 words a day you're in big trouble (which means you won't finish your 50k words in 30 days). That was the motivation I needed. I plan on replicating that again this year.

 

[Grandpa]

I have had what you mentioned happen to me. You follow other people's advice and "Have the life sucked out of it." The trick is to know what advice to heed and which to ignore.

Do you write to get published or are you writing for the enjoyment of it? Or both?

Sorry for the delay. It's been a busy coupla days.

I write for the enjoyment of it. The kids liked the stories, growing up. One about cockroaches creeped them out, big-time.

I wrote a short-short once that has stayed one of my very favorites. I shared it with an online writer friend at the time, and she took it to her publisher who said, "I'll take it. But too thin. Have him flesh it out." I couldn't do it. I felt it had everything I wanted in it. I talked to Grandma. She loved the story and agreed with me.

I've had nonfiction things published as journal articles, unpaid, just contributing to the good of the order.

 

[Grandpa]

Do you have your story online. Maybe I'll take a look.

I don't have that particular story online. I have other fiction and nonfiction stuff blogged, but it seems to me that when you're in the 20,000-word range, it's a bit much for blogging, especially when there's a very limited number of readers anyway.

I just finished up another one of 21,000 words and change, and started my next, which I anticipate will be about the same. I'm thinking of doing a book-sized collection, but it's a big insecurity bump to go from sharing something with family and friends that they all like to schlepping it out to too-busy agents or the self-publishing route.

 

[blunthead]

Somewhere from 0 to 3,000 words at a stretch. When work and family calls, that's what takes precedence, and they call a lot.

The story I wrote that wowed friends and family was about 22,000 words, and I wrote it in fairly short order (you can take that both ways), over about two weeks, maybe a little more, in my spare time. It got a couple of close friends excited enough that they told me, do some character development, add more narrative, make it a real book, and it'll sell! I did what they said, made it more like 55,000 words, and in doing so sucked the life out of it. So it's back to 22,000-25,000 words, sitting around as a trophy to the endeavor of artistic self-fulfillment.

I generally know exactly where I want to end up with my story. The problem is getting there. Sometimes the narrative flows. Sometimes it doesn't. Positive attitude can be a problem. When work is going well, the assignments are pouring in, the patrons are happy and shelling out the money, then I'm busy, productive, happy, and feeling good enough that I'm motivated to write, which detracts from the work production, which then kinda spoils how good work is going, so I focus back on the work, and then the muse is chewing on my ear, telling me that the words are flowing, so pay attention to the story, dangit!

Ah, well. There are worse problems to have.

A funny thing happened to me yesterday. I posted in the thread What do you wish SK would write about?, half joking. Then I got an idea and started writing my own story on the subject I'd jokingly suggested. I wrote a rough draft or outline of an entire story, very short so far. I didn't worry about certain issues, the important thing being getting the essential idea on paper (as it were). Usually I have a problem deciding on a conclusion; this time it was easy. The story told me about itself and how it wanted to end.

Now though, I know it needs to be fleshed out, and probably a lot. After all as is, it's all of 1 1/2 pages. Being as amateur a "writer" (ha) as a person can possibly be, I have no experience, other than having read other great authors which I can use for mentoring purposes, "fleshing out". But, I'm kinda excited because I think I just might be able to create a monster that has life.

 

[Lepplady]

I know people that subscribe to the theory of writing whatever comes to them, whenever inspiration hits, with no real idea of where the story's going. I call that Daisy-tripping. Not one of them has published yet.
Speaking only for myself, I need to write an outline. I do all the hard work and decision making first, in a synopsis-style outline. Then I can relax and enjoy the writing itself. I liken it to building a trellis then letting the flowers grow on it.
That doesn't mean it's written in blood on stone. If I realize that a plot point doesn't work, I'll change it. Or if a character looks me in the eye and says "I'm not doing that." I'll change it. But I know, in general, where the story's going, so I have a comfort zone to run in.
And, yes. I do set a word count for myself. 2000. That's for motivation, not to punish myself for if I don't hit it. Some days I'll make 3000 or more. Others, I might squeeze out a few hundred. Either way, if it's quality work, I feel it's a job well done for the day.