dan Brown, the one about the 'unbreakable system' fascinated me. There is NO such thing as an unbreakable system. With the worm virus doing a loop seem like a bit of fun I do on a day off. Only kidding
Dan Brown
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It's annoying. I really should have hated The Da Vinci Code because, frankly, it's not the best-written thing in the world and the 'big reveal' wasn't that big because I'd already figured it all out (for a 'labyrinthine' plot it certainly seemed a bit A -> B -> C, at least to me), but...I didn't, and don't, hate it. I'm not going to pretend it had some kind of life-changing (or affirming) effect, as some books can, but purely as a story...it was pretty good.
(Angels and Demons is better, though.)
(Note: Unlike some around here, I'm not at all religious, and never did have much time for organised religion. A lot of the basics in the books are true, re: the 'sacred feminine', the Church's historic attempts to tell their own story and silence the past, etc. But there's also respect for the Church, so you generally get to see both sides. It gives the story/ies strength, IMO.)
Mr Nobody I am none religious too, but I am fascinated by the concept. If you ask me am I catholic I will ask you who created god and who was behind him. People have the right to believe in whatever they want. we are supposed to be living in a democracy. As for dan brown, The female protagonist intellectually her mind interests me, she purportedly has iq of 208. Do you realise how bored she gets without being challengend with her mind.
Well...it's debatable whether we live in any kind of real democracy or not, and freedom is kind of a myth. I mean, just try telling folks you're dropping out of the rat race, then tell the State you won't be paying any taxes, see what happens. Then there are beliefs that aren't socially acceptable (at least, not anymore). I'd also argue that people should no longer have the 'right' to believe that the Earth is flat, as an example - or should at least be offered help if they persist. But, where most religions are concerned, both sides can argue the balance of probabilities until they're blue in the face (and have done).
The thing that baffles me is, you tell kids that their imaginary friend is nonsense, but call that imaginary friend God, or Allah, or whatever and dress a bloke up in a frock...different story. (Now, folks of a religious persuasion, that's my opinion there and you won't sway me from it any more than I can sway you from yours. That's not what I'm trying to do, nor am I trying to get up anyone's nose. Well, not much, anyway.
)Anyhoo...
IMO, the interesting thing about the stories is the way Dan Brown both criticises the Church and offers a more sympathetic view of it. It's all pretty thought provoking and even someone like me could get a further glimpse of why people buy whatever they're selling. They're also fairly well grounded in fact, historical and 'current', despite basically being a flight of fantasy. The ideas, concepts and controversies are fascinating, whichever side of the fence you're on. (At least IMO.)
I didn't know what her purported IQ was, tbh. Mine's 164 (I've been certified...er...hang on...) and my mind tends to chew the furniture. 208...wow. That would be...awful. Good job she's just a bag of bones, eh?
Yeah he's got some biggies. His blockbuster was "The Da Vinci Code". But "Angels & Demons" was close (both made into major motion pictures with Tom Hanks as Robert Langdon). I'm currently reading "The Lost Symbol" and really getting into it.
Houdini in Omaha
I think Dan Brown is a bit of a plagarist. He states so called facts that nobody can find evidence of,also. Do I like his books....gawd YES! Digital Fortress is my favorite. I have read them all.
Yeah the authors of Holy Blood, Holy Grail took him to court for plagiarism. I think he won eventually, even more so as it gave more publicity for the book (The DaVinci Code). I got tattoos of the Illuminati palindrome and Illuminati diamond from Angels and Demons
Yeah, he won the case. Not so difficult to see why. Holy Blood, Holy grail is a factbook (though i do think its facts are very dubious but it claims to be that at least so lets stick with it) written by Michael Baigent and one more who i forget the name of. Brown has obviously read the book, seen it as a inspiration for a highly fictional story and gone from there. But you cant claim that every historical novel or novel with history as part of its plot are plagiaristic in intent just because they use more or less solid historical theories as a basis for their novel. Then historical novels would be impossible. Which would really be a pity because i like them a lot.
You're a better person than I am, Kurben. Historical fiction that gets a lot of the history wrong drives me CRAZY. I couldn't get past I think the 4th chapter of Da Vinci--too silly and overwrought for me.
Didn't like it either but since he used a "factbook" (The holy blood, holy grail - book) as a basis i feel more inclined to be angry at them then at Brown when it comes to the Davinci code. Deception point is not history based therefore i think it is Ok. I think it is ok to toy a little with history in fiction. To fill the gaps so to say. Or to put a non-historical person as your main character and use the real historical persons as people he or she interact with. But Brown rarely toys just a little. He breaks the back of credibility because he spins his historybased plotthread to manytimes. You and I might see it but those who doesn't doesn't even seem to care that it is way away from real history. But he is good at cliffhangers but that is also all he is good at. The sad thing is that he inspired a lot of others to write similar completely way away from anything to do with history thrillers. From my point of view it would have been better if the Da Vinci code never had been written. So many silly questions it has given rise to!
The only truth I could find in the end was 'The Vatican has secrets and knows more than anyone lets on'.
And apparently they also have just discovered many hundreds of millions of dollars in their 'vaults' today, if the ticker-tape at the bottom of the TV this morning is to be believed!!
Yeah, I saw the 'oh, we were going to say we were broke, but we've found lots of money in accounts we'd forgotten all about!' thing.
And being good Christian folks, presumably having taken vows to shun Earthly comforts and so on, they won't mind divvying it all up to the world's poor, will they? What with it being Christmas and all...
Don't worry. I'm not about to hold my breath.
And being good Christian folks, presumably having taken vows to shun Earthly comforts and so on, they won't mind divvying it all up to the world's poor, will they? What with it being Christmas and all...
Don't worry. I'm not about to hold my breath.
In each his novel Dan Brown opens some secrets. Real social secrets. And I like it. Now I am reading his Inferno. For me it is not the best Dan Brown's novel. However, what about idea of overpopulation and sterialization as its solving? Is it only fiction? Or maybe reality? For example, in the early 1900s Fabian Society members advocated the ideal of a scientifically planned society and supported eugenics by way of sterilization... And what about AIDS? Maybe it is a real prototype of Dan Brown's plague?
A good writer or not a good writer, Dan Brown makes us to think.
A good writer or not a good writer, Dan Brown makes us to think.
Yep, and they should have won. I have read both authors and the similarities are more than amazing...they are suspect.
I don't honestly know the exact outcome of the case. I have read both books also. I think Dan Brown did a great job of taking some great "factual" ideas and turning them into a fictional story. The fact people were arguing over it is testament to how good a job he did,a bit cheesy at times. The writers of Holy Blood, Holy Grail definitely benefited from it. I definitely wouldn't have read their book otherwise. My tattoos are in the thread "tattoo" btw
Of course Brown had read the book. Both his book is fiction and he says so while the other is a fact book (they say). But to build a fictitious story from a historical theory (if rather bad theory) can't be called plagiarism. Then many historical novels would be unwritten because of fear of ending up in court.
I read Holy Blood, Holy Grail in the mid 90's. When Brown's book came out I knew the plot instantly because of that. I know his books are popular but I found them poorly written. I agree with Kurban about the plagiarism idea. I didn't know the HB,HG authors had sued him. Seems like sour grapes. They propose an odd, and factually unsound historical theory, and some writer takes the underlying idea and writes a thriller out of it. That's not plagiarism. No one gets to own historical facts. They're hoisted by their own petard. If they believe their theory is fact, it's not plagiarism: if they think it's fiction, then they deny their own book. That's a non-starter of a law-suit.
But if you like that genre of book, I'll throw the best I've read of that type out there: Umberto Eco's "Foucoult's Pendulum." The writing is tight, the characters vivid. The plot excellent.
As for religion and its role in the world, well, it's like everything else in this world. It's made up of human beings with all that human beings bring to the party. That means that hypocrisy, power, wealth, control and all kinds of wickedness will show itself under the name religion. It does not follow that there is therefore no Truth, simply because there are many Falsehoods. In fact, given our ancient enemy, one would expect exactly that, no? Scripture explicitly says that. It should be no surprise.
Kelly
But if you like that genre of book, I'll throw the best I've read of that type out there: Umberto Eco's "Foucoult's Pendulum." The writing is tight, the characters vivid. The plot excellent.
As for religion and its role in the world, well, it's like everything else in this world. It's made up of human beings with all that human beings bring to the party. That means that hypocrisy, power, wealth, control and all kinds of wickedness will show itself under the name religion. It does not follow that there is therefore no Truth, simply because there are many Falsehoods. In fact, given our ancient enemy, one would expect exactly that, no? Scripture explicitly says that. It should be no surprise.
Kelly
Eco is the anti-Dan Brown (lol). Tight writing, strong storylines, excellent historical scholarship, logical plotting. Iain Pears has some very good books in this genre (historical fiction), as well
Liked The Name of the Rose" even more. But after those two i think Eco, as a storyteller, has been too caught up in his immense learning. so that the storyline kind of ran into a wall. But if you like Eco you should try Hilary Mantel. Wolf Hall and Bring up the Bodies about Sir Thomas Cromwell, advisor to Henry VIII when he had all those problems with Catherine of Aragon, Anne Boleyn and Jane Seymour. Good writing and great scholarship about that part of Tudor-england. But it is not a mystery of course. If you like historical mysteries i can recommend Steven Saylor. Takes place in Rome when Cicero, Pompey and a young Ceasar is stalking the streets of Rome. Roman Blood is the first in the series.