What Are You Reading? Part Deux

  • This message board permanently closed on June 30th, 2020 at 4PM EDT and is no longer accepting new members.

Kurben

The Fool on the Hill
Apr 12, 2014
9,682
65,192
59
sweden
Have started to read a book called Explaining Hitler. It is not so much about Hitler as about the people that have tried to explain Hitler (from the 1920 to about 2000) from historians to psychohistorians to psychoanalysts. How they take their own bias into their explanation model. Also the historians that maintain that Hitler is beyond explanation. Which, to me at least, is a strange stand to take. I can agree sofar as saying that no really complete explanation has surfaced but saying he is beyond explanation is to me a way of saying he is beyond human understanding. It is a comforting thought maybe but it also kind of makes him an embodiment of evil just like Christ is an embodiment of good. Hitler was no demon but a human being just like you and i and so capable of explanation. That the majority of explanations has tried to make the åroblem simple (he was beaten as a child, He was partjew and hated jews because of it, he only had one testicle, and so on) instead of seeing it as a complex problem that demands an explanation where several factors play different parts. This book is interesting in that way that it points out both strengths and weaknesses in these explanations. Theres even a chapter here on those nuts that deny that the holocaust ever occurred.
 

Spideyman

Uber Member
Jul 10, 2006
46,336
195,472
79
Just north of Duma Key
Have started to read a book called Explaining Hitler. It is not so much about Hitler as about the people that have tried to explain Hitler (from the 1920 to about 2000) from historians to psychohistorians to psychoanalysts. How they take their own bias into their explanation model. Also the historians that maintain that Hitler is beyond explanation. Which, to me at least, is a strange stand to take. I can agree sofar as saying that no really complete explanation has surfaced but saying he is beyond explanation is to me a way of saying he is beyond human understanding. It is a comforting thought maybe but it also kind of makes him an embodiment of evil just like Christ is an embodiment of good. Hitler was no demon but a human being just like you and i and so capable of explanation. That the majority of explanations has tried to make the åroblem simple (he was beaten as a child, He was partjew and hated jews because of it, he only had one testicle, and so on) instead of seeing it as a complex problem that demands an explanation where several factors play different parts. This book is interesting in that way that it points out both strengths and weaknesses in these explanations. Theres even a chapter here on those nuts that deny that the holocaust ever occurred.
You always seem to find the most interesting books with complex concepts.
 

Tery

Say hello to my fishy buddy
Moderator
Apr 12, 2006
15,304
44,712
Bremerton, Washington, United States
Just finished The Witches of New York. It was quite good, the author obviously did her homework. The Witches were more like we real witches are; tea, herbs, knots, feathers... you know, real stuff. There are ghosts, too. I was taken in by how quickly the characters are built, being as I'm used to a slower pace. I'm hoping there is a sequel as I really enjoyed their company.
 

cat in a bag

Well-Known Member
Aug 28, 2010
12,038
67,827
wyoming
I started The Land of Stories The Wishing Spell by Chris Colfer. He played Kurt in the show Glee. Turns out he is a good storyteller, too!

It is the first book of six and although written for kids, I am enjoying it very much. Fairy tales were always a favorite when I was little and the characters in these books fall into The Land of Stories, where the fairy tale people are real. Magical so far! :biggrin2:
 

Kurben

The Fool on the Hill
Apr 12, 2014
9,682
65,192
59
sweden
I never considered him evil. Only half nuts.
He’s like the poster boy for “worst historical figure”. And while he was certainly bad, There were other dictators who did arguably worse.
In my view the scary thing about Hitler is not that he was evil or crazy or something like that.It is that he wasn't. He wasn't evil (depending on which definition of evil we use of course but one of the most common is "the total absence of Good" and then he wasn't evil. He wasn't crazy (actually until things started to go very wrong on the battlefields in 43-44 he was rather shrewd and good in manipulating people, after that he started to get rather maniacal and forget realities but that was a Hitler that started to evolve after Kursk in 1943, not earlier) and that means that something like him can happen again and that is the best reason not to let him and the holocaust pass into the mists of historical argument. It happened once and it can happen again. We must be on the lookout. And with something like him i mean not a criminal warlord that rule a small area but deceive noone but a criminal politician that manages to take control over a country and is deceiving voters, opponents and enemies alike. During the 20,ties and early 30,ties Hitler Deceived Germany to think of him as a clown which was,i think a conscious strategy of his. That you dont take serious you dont arm yourself against.

By the way i have started to read The Rise And Fall Of The Dinosaurs. written in 2018. There is a lot of new developments in research i wasn't aware of. Interesting.
 

Wayoftheredpanda

Flaming Wonder Telepath
May 15, 2018
4,907
22,094
20
In my view the scary thing about Hitler is not that he was evil or crazy or something like that.It is that he wasn't. He wasn't evil (depending on which definition of evil we use of course but one of the most common is "the total absence of Good" and then he wasn't evil. He wasn't crazy (actually until things started to go very wrong on the battlefields in 43-44 he was rather shrewd and good in manipulating people, after that he started to get rather maniacal and forget realities but that was a Hitler that started to evolve after Kursk in 1943, not earlier) and that means that something like him can happen again and that is the best reason not to let him and the holocaust pass into the mists of historical argument. It happened once and it can happen again. We must be on the lookout. And with something like him i mean not a criminal warlord that rule a small area but deceive noone but a criminal politician that manages to take control over a country and is deceiving voters, opponents and enemies alike. During the 20,ties and early 30,ties Hitler Deceived Germany to think of him as a clown which was,i think a conscious strategy of his. That you dont take serious you dont arm yourself against.

By the way i have started to read The Rise And Fall Of The Dinosaurs. written in 2018. There is a lot of new developments in research i wasn't aware of. Interesting.
Hitler was a genius, he knew how to get people on his side. The worst part is he didn’t see what he did as wrong. To him, his ideologies were right. This doesnt change the fact that what he did was horrible, but it’s interesting to think about his motivations.
 
  • Like
Reactions: GNTLGNT

Kurben

The Fool on the Hill
Apr 12, 2014
9,682
65,192
59
sweden
Hitler was a genius, he knew how to get people on his side. The worst part is he didn’t see what he did as wrong. To him, his ideologies were right. This doesnt change the fact that what he did was horrible, but it’s interesting to think about his motivations.
I wouldn't go as far as genius. And wrong....depends on what act you mean. If killing jews then in his deluded view of race and nationality it was a rational thing to do(or say at least) So that, to him, might have seen right. But the way he got in a position to actually do it... He killed, or rather had other kill them, many political leaders, cleansed his own party of people who did not agree with him. Not to speak of the many journalists that just disappeared into different camps. He know this was wrong but did it anyway. One, i think, interesting thing about him was that he was extremely aware of the difference between what you say or write (say in the speeches or Mein Kampf) and what you do. He could say the most outrageous things but he didn't do anything outrageous until he had enough people following him. The only time he misjudged was the euthanasi program where mentally sick people and other imperfect humans (regardless of race) were put to death. The german people stopped that. It was so impopular that Hitler stopped it.
 

Wayoftheredpanda

Flaming Wonder Telepath
May 15, 2018
4,907
22,094
20
I wouldn't go as far as genius. And wrong....depends on what act you mean
In a way, he was. Smart in his own right. Like many dictators, he knew how to reach goals through nefarious purposes. The Nazis has found a way to efficiently work people to death, and as horrible as it is, it shows how calculated of a horror they were. Like I said, Hitler may have been one of the most infamous and horrifying figures of the 20th century, but like other dictators, he was an interesting character.
 
  • Like
Reactions: GNTLGNT

Moderator

Ms. Mod
Administrator
Jul 10, 2006
52,243
157,324
Maine
Hitler was a genius, he knew how to get people on his side. The worst part is he didn’t see what he did as wrong. To him, his ideologies were right. This doesnt change the fact that what he did was horrible, but it’s interesting to think about his motivations.
Narcissistic sociopath might be a better description than genius.
 

Moderator

Ms. Mod
Administrator
Jul 10, 2006
52,243
157,324
Maine
I’m not defending Hitler, I hate him and what he did as much as you do, but to say he wasn’t smart is to understate.
I did not say he wasn't smart, now did I? Nor did I say you were defending him. And this is why we no longer have a hot topics area for political discussions. Comments are quickly turned around to mean something that was never intended in the first place and things go off the rails.
 

Wayoftheredpanda

Flaming Wonder Telepath
May 15, 2018
4,907
22,094
20
I did not say he wasn't smart, now did I? Nor did I say you were defending him. And this is why we no longer have a hot topics area for political discussions. Comments are quickly turned around to mean something that was never intended in the first place and things go off the rails.
I was trying to reiterate what I was trying to say because it seemed my choice of words was not great. I didn’t mean to blow the conversation out of proportion, a balls joke about everyone’s least favorite Austrian flew over my head and I ended up making a somewhat political statement about the statistics of him compared to other 20th century dictators.