I Didn't Really Like It

AGP said:

I meant to post this a little sooner, but here it is just the same: I thought It had way too many tangentials. Way too much "fat." In short, I thought that it is fairly unfocused. And "I loved you guys so much" hurt me, but it also felt unnecessary (works brilliantly in Stand By Me, but I don't think it belonged in It). I think it's really unnacceptable that they don't get to remember each other.

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I like the element of their losing memories associated with the horror they'd experienced. That's reminiscent of real life, and I've always really dug sK's way of tying the supernatural to the natural. Horror fiction is scarier that way because it reminds us that horror happens in real life.

I'm not sure what you mean with the underlined quote; that it hurt you. Can you explain?

AGP said:

Sure: it hurt me because, as in Stand By Me, they were losing each other. But even in Stand By Me, the protagonist at least got to remember his friends. "I really loved you" is a lot like Charlie's circumstances in Flowers for Algernon. Again, I think that works for Charlie but I don't think it does for It. Even if they didn't remember the horror (or the metaphysics associated with having experienced it), they should remember each other. Otherwise it feels like the Universe got them together for the sole purpose of defeating It (and thus, diminishes their friendship by a good deal).

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Ok, thanx. I appreciate the explanation. I wonder though if we all shouldn't consider and accept that some friendships, maybe most even, are temporary; maybe it's unhealthy to demand they all last forever. Life is change. Even love, the greatest, most coveted and revered of human accomplishments, changes. I don't think the Universe insensitively brought the Losers together just to defeat evil - they did experience love together; love being always uniquely personal (maybe symbolized through Bev's act and explains its need, as each of the boys' relationship with her was unique and different) - but also for whatever purpose there is in reality for friendships to end.

AGP said:

Otherwise it feels like the Universe got them together for the sole purpose of defeating It (and thus, diminishes their friendship by a good deal).

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I guess I always thought that WAS why the Universe (turtle) got them together, to right a horrible wrong in a way only kids could. Then the power of the friendship that developed is what made it possible

Wow typos, sorry last sentence is supposed to be:

I used to think that It had way too much extra stuff. I read it again recently and saw that the information had to be there to explain why they were the adults they became. And yes, things change. That is the only constant. All relationships change. Spousal, parental, friends. You may still love these people, but things change. I'm willing to bet there are people all of us have known from school that we've forgotten.

doowopgirl said:

I used to think that It had way too much extra stuff. I read it again recently and saw that the information had to be there to explain why they were the adults they became. And yes, things change. That is the only constant. All relationships change. Spousal, parental, friends. You may still love these people, but things change. I'm willing to bet there are people all of us have known from school that we've forgotten.

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That's what I mean. I've been fortunate in that I'm still in touch with many of my closest friends from high school days - and these were the days whence many grand adventures did occur - but there are those friends who've become a part of my past. They've moved on and so have I, and that's not tragic or even wrong but a fact of life. Hopefully though, for everyone certain relationships last, even through change.

We will have to agree to disagree. My only complaint about the novel was that it was just too short. I say that tongue and cheek, but it is absolutely true.

Robert Gray said:

We will have to agree to disagree. My only complaint about the novel was that it was just too short. I say that tongue and cheek, but it is absolutely true.

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Hi Robert Gray! - nice to see you back here posting

Neesy said:

Hi Robert Gray! - nice to see you back here posting

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I'm always around, just been too slammed by school and my "get to Maine" program to comment much.

Robert Gray said:

I'm always around, just been too slammed by school and my "get to Maine" program to comment much.

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Good luck with that and let us know when you get there

I have to disagree with you AGP. I think that all the extra detail, what you term as fat is elemental to the story.. To set the background,and the mood.I think the ending is perfect as is.. I think that this is a perfect ode to our childhood and perhaps the saying goodbye to that childhood.. And though not easy, it is all necessary..I am just finishing re reading it again and everytime I do it reminds me why I love it so much.. It reminds me what is really important..Life,our families, friends,and the memories we make..

AGP said:

"Life,our families, friends,and the memories we make.."

Ah, but isn't that my point? They didn't make any memories.

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Disliking the fact that the adult Losers move on and forget their young childhood (and the nightmare return as adults) seems an odd reason to dislike an entire book. In fairness, the Losers are very young. I didn't even face a supernatural monster and while I have vague flashes of my friends back then, they are nothing more than images and events. The names... I don't trust. Isn't it enough to know that I had friends? We aren't talking about High School and up. We are talking barely approaching Middle School. If anything the Losers were granted something most of the rest of us never get. They had their memories of childhood returned to them as adults and got to remember each other for a few days with great clarity.

...sometimes memories hurt and are beyond being able to lug around in the old brain box...I think the "amnesia" was a blessing rather than a book spoiler...

AGP said:

"Life,our families, friends,and the memories we make.."

Ah, but isn't that my point? They didn't make any memories.

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Which is why it is also a reminder to us,to cherish and value the memories we DO have..their circumstance was a special one,to which they stood up bravely..and perhaps to remember it all would have served to drive them crazy..who knows..I just enjoyed the book immensely,and like life,nothing always turns out fair or just right..I took it as that..good thread!

AGP said:

Well, the end does inform the rest of it, doesn't it? I dislike the fact that I spent a few days with people who were no more than puppets, and whose friendship was manufactured by a higher plan.

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Yes and no. They were never directly puppets per say. The Other was waiting for the right children because the Lord helps those who help themselves. If puppets were all that was required, the force which helped the Losers could have been rid of It centuries before. There were still choices to be made. In Dark Tower terms, the Losers still had to stand and be true. This happened both as children and as adults. Unlike Henry Bowers and his crew, the Losers were still afforded choices. Once those choices were made, however, they were within the cogs and wheels of a great machine.

And then, were forever made to forget everything. Completely. By the way, I do remember my childhood friends, and even have some contact with some of them. It's my college friends that I mostly don't see, with the exception of one.

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Again, I don't see the issue. The story is solid. The characters are strong. The reward is earned. Whether or not they remember the details of their nightmare seems unimportant. If anything, it seems like a mercy to me. I remember my childhood friends too, but only in a vague, non-distinct kind of way. If you have stronger recollections you are more the exception than the rule. Irregardless, your beef makes no sense to me. Even if they had a memory of the events, it wouldn't mean that they hadn't been helped by unseen forces. If the real value is in the journey and not the destination, it makes no difference whatsoever what they remember.