The real battle for the Tower

[Bobby Sawyer]

Is the real battle for the Tower between Walter and the Crimson King?

Going back through the path to the Tower again and am starting to realize that Roland and his Ka seem only to be pushed closer to the Tower by Walter. Walter may seem to be trying to stop Roland but everything he does aides the Gunslinger in his quest.

Did he force hin into an early test to get rid of him or did he know he would succeed and set the course of his journey to Hambry?

He allowed Roland to fall in love so great it would lead him on a neverending quest for the Tower. He placed Jake in his path and the doorways for Roland to draw the rest of hi Ka-tet. Sure he killed Jake and Susan and required Roland to let Jake die again but all that played into preparing Roland to make it to the Tower.

Im think Walter was playing his game of Castles against the Crimson King and Roland was his chosen game piece. He of course played both sides all the way through planning on using Roland as his key to the Tower and to defeat the Crimson King his true advisary. He created Rolands lust for the Tower the same way Roland created it for Eddie. But Roland never makes it to the Tower without Walters help.

Everything the Crimson King is doing to stop Roland is undone by Walter. The King tried to kill Patrick Danville, but someone else took him and placed him in Rolands path to the Tower. My feeling is Walter would have known the King wanted Patrick dead because he was the one who could stop him. I feel Walter took him and placed him in Dandelos hand knowning Roland would free him and defeat the Crimson King then at the last minute Walter could deafeat Roland and take the Tower himself.

Maybe this is why Roland is sent back again. Mayhap he needs to earn his place in the Tower by himself with out the aid of Walter.

Who knows, either way its worth another read through or maybe seven.

 

[Edward John]

Is the real battle for the Tower between Walter and the Crimson King?

Going back through the path to the Tower again and am starting to realize that Roland and his Ka seem only to be pushed closer to the Tower by Walter. Walter may seem to be trying to stop Roland but everything he does aides the Gunslinger in his quest.

Did he force hin into an early test to get rid of him or did he know he would succeed and set the course of his journey to Hambry?

He allowed Roland to fall in love so great it would lead him on a neverending quest for the Tower. He placed Jake in his path and the doorways for Roland to draw the rest of hi Ka-tet. Sure he killed Jake and Susan and required Roland to let Jake die again but all that played into preparing Roland to make it to the Tower.

Im think Walter was playing his game of Castles against the Crimson King and Roland was his chosen game piece. He of course played both sides all the way through planning on using Roland as his key to the Tower and to defeat the Crimson King his true advisary. He created Rolands lust for the Tower the same way Roland created it for Eddie. But Roland never makes it to the Tower without Walters help.

Everything the Crimson King is doing to stop Roland is undone by Walter. The King tried to kill Patrick Danville, but someone else took him and placed him in Rolands path to the Tower. My feeling is Walter would have known the King wanted Patrick dead because he was the one who could stop him. I feel Walter took him and placed him in Dandelos hand knowning Roland would free him and defeat the Crimson King then at the last minute Walter could deafeat Roland and take the Tower himself.

Maybe this is why Roland is sent back again. Mayhap he needs to earn his place in the Tower by himself with out the aid of Walter.

Who knows, either way its worth another read through or maybe seven.

It's an interesting idea. Remember though, Walter is murdered by The Crimson King (And Roland's) son. You have to remember that The Crimson King is essentially mad so there might not be any order to his madness. Well, an argument could be made that Walter is also stuck in the spiral, same as Roland, and why would he want to be stuck as well? Some of the things go down to Ka, it's essentially King's Deus Ex Machina, it's used to get the plot moving and explain some of the problems. Walter's was essentially acting in the King's orders. I doubt that Walter purposefully wanted Roland to reach the King and the Tower, he doesn't seem smart enough if I'm being honest, plus he doesn't know what is at the top of the tower either.

 

[Bobby Sawyer]

It's an interesting idea. Remember though, Walter is murdered by The Crimson King (And Roland's) son. You have to remember that The Crimson King is essentially mad so there might not be any order to his madness. Well, an argument could be made that Walter is also stuck in the spiral, same as Roland, and why would he want to be stuck as well? Some of the things go down to Ka, it's essentially King's Deus Ex Machina, it's used to get the plot moving and explain some of the problems. Walter's was essentially acting in the King's orders. I doubt that Walter purposefully wanted Roland to reach the King and the Tower, he doesn't seem smart enough if I'm being honest, plus he doesn't know what is at the top of the tower either.

I think Walter thinks Mordred would keep Roland from the Tower and it was Walters undoing when he thought he could defeat Mordred. Maybe that or Mordred was wise to Walters plans to move against the Crimson King.

Also he could have been waiting for the King to go "mad" making him vunerable.

 

[Edward John]

I think Walter thinks Mordred would keep Roland from the Tower and it was Walters undoing when he thought he could defeat Mordred. Maybe that or Mordred was wise to Walters plans to move against the Crimson King.

Also he could have been waiting for the King to go "mad" making him vunerable.

I get that. Although, I think you might be overestimating Walter, he doesn't seem that smart to plan something like this, although it's still an interesting idea. The Crimson King was the creator of Mordred, not Walter, maybe Walter thought he could use him, but i don't think Walter wants Roland to reach the tower, I believe he lets him be because he wants him to suffer through remembering all of his mishaps. But that's just me.

 

[Bobby Sawyer]

I agree that Walter does love to see Roland suffer as much as possible, yet still in his best interest to get Roland to the Tower.

 

[mal]

Good theory. It makes a lot of sense.

 

[Edward John]

Good theory. It makes a lot of sense.

It's interesting. Great way to interpret it.

 

[GNTLGNT]

 

[Edward John]

I think I might have found an answer. If you remember in the book The Wizard in Glass, after Roland is finished recounting his tale in Kansas, they travel to a place which seems to be the Emerald City from the Wizard of Oz, they confront Walter at the city, were they find out him and Quick are the same, Walter then goes on to commend Roland for getting this far but tells him that his journey is at an end, Roland tries shooting him but Walter turns the bullets into blanks, the Ka-tet are only able to defeat Walter through Jake's gun, which is from his world so Walter is susceptible to it. They manage to scare Walter into running away, frightened that Roland nearly defeated him. That is when he leaves the grapefruit, and then we don't meet Walter until his demise. So, it doesn't seem as though Walter was pushing Roland to reach the Tower, he likely found it amusing to lead him onto that point, but from then on it's clear that Walter doesn't wan't Roland to reach the Tower. It is pretty clear that Walter intends for himself to reach it, and this is discarded once Roland nearly defeats him.

 

[Bobby Sawyer]

I think I might have found an answer. If you remember in the book The Wizard in Glass, after Roland is finished recounting his tale in Kansas, they travel to a place which seems to be the Emerald City from the Wizard of Oz, they confront Walter at the city, were they find out him and Quick are the same, Walter then goes on to commend Roland for getting this far but tells him that his journey is at an end, Roland tries shooting him but Walter turns the bullets into blanks, the Ka-tet are only able to defeat Walter through Jake's gun, which is from his world so Walter is susceptible to it. They manage to scare Walter into running away, frightened that Roland nearly defeated him. That is when he leaves the grapefruit, and then we don't meet Walter until his demise. So, it doesn't seem as though Walter was pushing Roland to reach the Tower, he likely found it amusing to lead him onto that point, but from then on it's clear that Walter doesn't wan't Roland to reach the Tower. It is pretty clear that Walter intends for himself to reach it, and this is discarded once Roland nearly defeats him.

What gets me is that he shows up in Lud and revives Quick before Lud's demise but does nothing to stop the Ka-tet from leaving Lud via Blaine. Without Blaine they have no way to traverse the wastelands and therefore no path to the Tower.

Walter was right there with them in Lud he could have attacked them and had them gassed with the rest of Lud or simply damaged a section of Blaines track leaving them for dead in the wastelands.

I think the Ka-tets power had grown stronger then he imagined. Maybe due to the fact that Roland shared his tale with them. I feel the significance of him remebering/sharing was powerful as what happend to Susan is what drives Roland and makes his journey so important to him. Because it already cost him everything so now everything/everyone can be sacrificed and his only salavtion is at the Tower.

I am working my way towards reaping day as I am currently rereading Wizard and Glass. Should have more perspective on this as I hit it with fresh eyes shortly.