New $10 Bill Will Feature a Woman

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Mr Nobody

Well-Known Member
Jul 9, 2008
3,306
9,050
Walsall, England
There have been many women who are the sole support for the family. At a woman's pay. Many times she is "the breadwinner" at 70/100 and she either works more hours, more jobs or makes do. And I believe it was a man/men who gave themselves the honor of "breadwinner".

Indeed there have, which is why pay should be (and should have been) much more equal. And I say "much more equal" only because two men doing exactly the same job don't always get exactly the same pay (experience and what-not comes into play), though it'll be fairly close.
As for men giving themselves 'the honour'...I don't know who started it - presumably it's as old as currency itself - but it would have been those in power and/or who had the most to gain who shut those doors. Other men would have found themselves in a position of being expected by society to become or remain as the provider (which stems from "man = hunter -> provider"). Over centuries that becomes embedded.
All I know is, I was raised in that way: men were the breadwinners, and a man who was not or could not adequately provide for his wife or family was a failure - and seen by society and other men as 'no man at all'. When you're raised to fulfil a role to the extent that it defines identity - just as women were/are - the fear of failure and all that it means can be a heavy burden...and one that the majority of men do not and did not ask for or (whisper it) even want.
Ultimately, though, if you have a system whereby men are given the breadwinner role or are expected to earn more than their wives or girlfriends, the situation is created whereby men have to earn more while women pick up relatively little. It never really worked in the past for the reason you point out, but those instances were in the minority and so nothing changed (leaving many families desperate as a result). Society has moved on and there are a great many more women who are sole providers, but there's still the idea about that men have to be the breadwinner - and that comes from women as well as, if not more than, other men, generally speaking.
It's not just pay equality that needs to happen, but full equality in terms of roles and expectations.

I always saw the "breadwinner" excuse for paying men more as just that, an excuse by employers to maintain the status quo--sort of an "old boys club" thing. I'd agree with you about there being a sharing of financial responsibilities in a household but that's always been my philosophy. These days, though, the majority of women who work outside the home are doing so because it's a financial necessity.

Yes. It shouldn't be - one income, no matter who earns it, should be enough to keep a household at least ticking along; anything else is simply unfair to single parents as well as singles without kids - but it is as it is for now.
 

Sigmund

Waiting in Uber.
Jan 3, 2010
13,979
44,046
In your mirror.
Indeed there have, which is why pay should be (and should have been) much more equal. And I say "much more equal" only because two men doing exactly the same job don't always get exactly the same pay (experience and what-not comes into play), though it'll be fairly close.
As for men giving themselves 'the honour'...I don't know who started it - presumably it's as old as currency itself - but it would have been those in power and/or who had the most to gain who shut those doors. Other men would have found themselves in a position of being expected by society to become or remain as the provider (which stems from "man = hunter -> provider"). Over centuries that becomes embedded.
All I know is, I was raised in that way: men were the breadwinners, and a man who was not or could not adequately provide for his wife or family was a failure - and seen by society and other men as 'no man at all'. When you're raised to fulfil a role to the extent that it defines identity - just as women were/are - the fear of failure and all that it means can be a heavy burden...and one that the majority of men do not and did not ask for or (whisper it) even want.
Ultimately, though, if you have a system whereby men are given the breadwinner role or are expected to earn more than their wives or girlfriends, the situation is created whereby men have to earn more while women pick up relatively little. It never really worked in the past for the reason you point out, but those instances were in the minority and so nothing changed (leaving many families desperate as a result). Society has moved on and there are a great many more women who are sole providers, but there's still the idea about that men have to be the breadwinner - and that comes from women as well as, if not more than, other men, generally speaking.
It's not just pay equality that needs to happen, but full equality in terms of roles and expectations.



Yes. It shouldn't be - one income, no matter who earns it, should be enough to keep a household at least ticking along; anything else is simply unfair to single parents as well as singles without kids - but it is as it is for now.


...........in general it has been the men who have done the raping and the robbing and the killing and the war-mongering for the last two thousand years.... and it's been the men who have done the pillaging and the beheading and the subjugating of whole races into slavery. It has been the men who have done the law making and the money making and the most of the mischief making! So if the world isn't quite what you had in mind you have only yourselves to thank!!



:)
 

TheRedQueen

And Crazy Housewife
Dec 3, 2014
1,346
8,164
36
Fernley, NV.
I feel so out of place...

My husband is the head of this household. He goes out every day and works his a** off to make sure we're taken care of. He keeps the bills in order, helps me with chores around the house when I ask for it, is an excellent father to his son, and when important issues come up, he has the final say.
I stay at home, look after our son, keep the house, and do what I can to help. That could mean getting the shopping done each day, (we shop by the day. it's surprisingly cheaper that way) doing the laundry, or maybe selling off some of my stuff so that I can help with the bills.
We each have huge responsibilities. And while our marriage may seem old fashioned, we talk about everything, we make all of our decisions together, we know how to come to compromise, we respect one another, and, in short, we are a team. Without my husband, I'd be up a creek. And without me, he'd be up a creek. We need each other. And I have a hard time understanding why this type of life has been demonized for so long. Gender roles aren't the problem. A lack of respect now, that's where the problem really is.

I know I'm in the minority here, and I don't expect anyone to understand my antiquated ways. But I wanted to throw my two cents in. Not everyone thinks feminism was a miracle. And now I will show myself out before the other ladies remove my traitorous head....:biggrin2:
 

RichardX

Well-Known Member
Sep 26, 2006
1,737
4,434
The sad thing about this type of ersatz issue is that it was no doubt well intended but digresses into an us against them mentality that has the exact opposite impact of its intent by becoming divisive. The average person could care less who is on their money. If they did, we would probably get LeBron James. They just want more of it. I bet 50% don't even know who is on the currency we already have. Making a big deal about it almost is a step backward by making it a distraction from things that matter. But I would go with Rosa Parks or Eleanor Roosevelt.
 

Sigmund

Waiting in Uber.
Jan 3, 2010
13,979
44,046
In your mirror.
I feel so out of place...

My husband is the head of this household. He goes out every day and works his a** off to make sure we're taken care of. He keeps the bills in order, helps me with chores around the house when I ask for it, is an excellent father to his son, and when important issues come up, he has the final say.
I stay at home, look after our son, keep the house, and do what I can to help. That could mean getting the shopping done each day, (we shop by the day. it's surprisingly cheaper that way) doing the laundry, or maybe selling off some of my stuff so that I can help with the bills.
We each have huge responsibilities. And while our marriage may seem old fashioned, we talk about everything, we make all of our decisions together, we know how to come to compromise, we respect one another, and, in short, we are a team. Without my husband, I'd be up a creek. And without me, he'd be up a creek. We need each other. And I have a hard time understanding why this type of life has been demonized for so long. Gender roles aren't the problem. A lack of respect now, that's where the problem really is.

I know I'm in the minority here, and I don't expect anyone to understand my antiquated ways. But I wanted to throw my two cents in. Not everyone thinks feminism was a miracle. And now I will show myself out before the other ladies remove my traitorous head....:biggrin2:

I wouldn't remove your head. :) I don't know any woman on this board who would.

I am a feminist. So was my husband. My son, brothers, BILS SILS etc. basically all my family are feminists. :blues:

We don't hate men :icon_eek: . Feminists want ... advocate ...THIS:

the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.


We don't want it free, we don't want more, we want the same.
(I enjoy seeing you on the board.)

Peace.
 

Moderator

Ms. Mod
Administrator
Jul 10, 2006
52,243
157,324
Maine
I wouldn't remove your head. :) I don't know any woman on this board who would.

I am a feminist. So was my husband. My son, brothers, BILS SILS etc. basically all my family are feminists. :blues:

We don't hate men :icon_eek: . Feminists want ... advocate ...THIS:

the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.


We don't want it free, we don't want more, we want the same.
(I enjoy seeing you on the board.)

Peace.
Exactly.

I won't apologize for being a feminist because that's the way I see it as well. There was a time in my life when I would not have even taken note of the 20 vs 10 bill because so many of these issues have been inculcated into our society and women, in particular, have been conditioned to dismiss them because it's not ladylike to raise a fuss. But I don't expect every female to agree with my stance and I do not have any issues with women--or men--who are stay at home parents and do not feel they need to apologize either. If that's what works for them, then more power to them.

If I was going to vote about whose face I'd like to see on the bill, it would probably be Eleanor Roosevelt as she's someone I've admired ever since my high school years.
 

doowopgirl

very avid fan
Aug 7, 2009
6,946
25,119
65
dublin ireland
Too soon?

MTE4MDAzNDEwMDU4NTc3NDIy.jpg
IMO, it will never be time for that picture.
 

TheRedQueen

And Crazy Housewife
Dec 3, 2014
1,346
8,164
36
Fernley, NV.
I wouldn't remove your head. :) I don't know any woman on this board who would.

I am a feminist. So was my husband. My son, brothers, BILS SILS etc. basically all my family are feminists. :blues:

We don't hate men :icon_eek: . Feminists want ... advocate ...THIS:

the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.


We don't want it free, we don't want more, we want the same.
(I enjoy seeing you on the board.)

Peace.


Thank you Siggy, that means more than I could say. :love:

And I don't necessarily have a problem with original feminism. Equality is something we should all strive for.
But equality is, to me, more than just a woman's fight, or a race fight, or a sexual fight. Equality is a human struggle, and has been for time out of mind. We don't seem to realize that we're all in this thing together, this thing called Life. We all need each other. And the easiest way to gain Human Equality is to simply recognize that fact. If every person had respect for their fellow humans, had empathy, if they cared, this world would be a much better place.
What I do have a problem with is extremists. Of any brand. And since we're on the topic of feminism, I'll talk about the extreme feminists I've run into, and maybe you'll understand why I'm a bit defensive.
See, even though my hubby is head of household, he treats me with utmost respect, which in turn makes me an equal. We may have "gender roles", but we coexist naturally and easily, which leads me to the opinion that gender roles and gender equality can go hand in hand.
Which, in turn, makes me an easy target for radicals. The ultra feminists, (you know the ones) look at me like I'm scum, a traitor to the cause. I treat my husband as an equal, the same way I want to be treated, and somehow, this makes me the worst kind of woman in the world...and THAT is the type of thinking I don't understand.
 

Moderator

Ms. Mod
Administrator
Jul 10, 2006
52,243
157,324
Maine
Thank you Siggy, that means more than I could say. :love:

And I don't necessarily have a problem with original feminism. Equality is something we should all strive for.
But equality is, to me, more than just a woman's fight, or a race fight, or a sexual fight. Equality is a human struggle, and has been for time out of mind. We don't seem to realize that we're all in this thing together, this thing called Life. We all need each other. And the easiest way to gain Human Equality is to simply recognize that fact. If every person had respect for their fellow humans, had empathy, if they cared, this world would be a much better place.
What I do have a problem with is extremists. Of any brand. And since we're on the topic of feminism, I'll talk about the extreme feminists I've run into, and maybe you'll understand why I'm a bit defensive.
See, even though my hubby is head of household, he treats me with utmost respect, which in turn makes me an equal. We may have "gender roles", but we coexist naturally and easily, which leads me to the opinion that gender roles and gender equality can go hand in hand.
Which, in turn, makes me an easy target for radicals. The ultra feminists, (you know the ones) look at me like I'm scum, a traitor to the cause. I treat my husband as an equal, the same way I want to be treated, and somehow, this makes me the worst kind of woman in the world...and THAT is the type of thinking I don't understand.
And that's the sort of relationship we should be striving for. Those extremists--on either side--are only causing more rifts and making it hard to hear the true message that at its heart is about respect.
 

GNTLGNT

The idiot is IN
Jun 15, 2007
87,651
358,754
62
Cambridge, Ohio
Exactly.

I won't apologize for being a feminist because that's the way I see it as well. There was a time in my life when I would not have even taken note of the 20 vs 10 bill because so many of these issues have been inculcated into our society and women, in particular, have been conditioned to dismiss them because it's not ladylike to raise a fuss. But I don't expect every female to agree with my stance and I do not have any issues with women--or men--who are stay at home parents and do not feel they need to apologize either. If that's what works for them, then more power to them.

If I was going to vote about whose face I'd like to see on the bill, it would probably be Eleanor Roosevelt as she's someone I've admired ever since my high school years.
2fcc4960fb675c1.jpg
 

Ashcrash

Well-Known Member
Jun 10, 2015
1,326
4,898
Wutsittoyu
UUUUUUUUh why don't they just wait until we have a first women president. Why break the cycle when it is inevitable there will be one. Then she can be on the money and we don't have to worry about it. The last thing I worry about while I am worrying about money is the fact there are no women on the money. I really could care less. I just look at the money and see 5 10 20 thats it dont care. Unless by a women being on the money it means i get more money then i could really care less. i mean really there are bigger things in life. :barf::beaten:
 

Mr Nobody

Well-Known Member
Jul 9, 2008
3,306
9,050
Walsall, England
...........in general it has been the men who have done the raping and the robbing and the killing and the war-mongering for the last two thousand years.... and it's been the men who have done the pillaging and the beheading and the subjugating of whole races into slavery. It has been the men who have done the law making and the money making and the most of the mischief making! So if the world isn't quite what you had in mind you have only yourselves to thank!!



:)

Yes. I can't and won't deny any of that. What I will do is add a couple of qualifiers: in general it has been a certain type of men who have done the raping, robbing, etc, as it has been a certain type of men who went in for the pillaging, beheading and slavery stuff, and most of it has been done at the behest (even under pain of imprisonment or death) of a certain class of men, since they've been the ones who've done the law-, money- and mischief-making largely for their own gain (and certain types of women have been involved in that too; you know the saying: Behind every strong man... and so on).
And it's all been going on for a lot longer than 2000 years. It's probably been going on, in some form or other, since our ancestors first climbed down from the trees and learned to walk erect...if not before.
You'd have thought - or at least hoped - that things might have changed at some point along the evolutionary path, but no...or at least, those civilizations that did form gender-equal societies didn't survive (for various reasons).

the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.

We don't want it free, we don't want more, we want the same.
(I enjoy seeing you on the board.)

Peace.

I know that was a reply to someone else, but...you do get that I agree with that/you, right?
Whatever the sins and wrongs of generations past, that's all done and gone. The only thing we can do is try to set things right in the present for the future. Right?
 

Ashcrash

Well-Known Member
Jun 10, 2015
1,326
4,898
Wutsittoyu
I feel so out of place...

My husband is the head of this household. He goes out every day and works his a** off to make sure we're taken care of. He keeps the bills in order, helps me with chores around the house when I ask for it, is an excellent father to his son, and when important issues come up, he has the final say.
I stay at home, look after our son, keep the house, and do what I can to help. That could mean getting the shopping done each day, (we shop by the day. it's surprisingly cheaper that way) doing the laundry, or maybe selling off some of my stuff so that I can help with the bills.
We each have huge responsibilities. And while our marriage may seem old fashioned, we talk about everything, we make all of our decisions together, we know how to come to compromise, we respect one another, and, in short, we are a team. Without my husband, I'd be up a creek. And without me, he'd be up a creek. We need each other. And I have a hard time understanding why this type of life has been demonized for so long. Gender roles aren't the problem. A lack of respect now, that's where the problem really is.

I know I'm in the minority here, and I don't expect anyone to understand my antiquated ways. But I wanted to throw my two cents in. Not everyone thinks feminism was a miracle. And now I will show myself out before the other ladies remove my traitorous head....:biggrin2:
Hey i think that is great!!!!
 

Mr Nobody

Well-Known Member
Jul 9, 2008
3,306
9,050
Walsall, England
I feel so out of place...

My husband is the head of this household. He goes out every day and works his a** off to make sure we're taken care of. He keeps the bills in order, helps me with chores around the house when I ask for it, is an excellent father to his son, and when important issues come up, he has the final say.
I stay at home, look after our son, keep the house, and do what I can to help. That could mean getting the shopping done each day, (we shop by the day. it's surprisingly cheaper that way) doing the laundry, or maybe selling off some of my stuff so that I can help with the bills.
We each have huge responsibilities. And while our marriage may seem old fashioned, we talk about everything, we make all of our decisions together, we know how to come to compromise, we respect one another, and, in short, we are a team. Without my husband, I'd be up a creek. And without me, he'd be up a creek. We need each other. And I have a hard time understanding why this type of life has been demonized for so long. Gender roles aren't the problem. A lack of respect now, that's where the problem really is.

I know I'm in the minority here, and I don't expect anyone to understand my antiquated ways. But I wanted to throw my two cents in. Not everyone thinks feminism was a miracle. And now I will show myself out before the other ladies remove my traitorous head....:biggrin2:

I meant to reply to this last night, but it was late here and I was tired, so...
This is where I'll say there is no contradiction with anything I've said (not that you claimed there was :smile2:). In fact, it's entirely in keeping, because the bit I've underlined shows that you still treat one another as equals. You've put your heads together, decided what works best for you, and got on with it. That's a far cry from your gender roles being imposed by societal expectations regardless of whether they work for you or not, or whether you want them or not, which they were for a long time and, to a lesser but still very/too substantial degree, still are.
It also gets to the heart of what I said about one income being enough to run a household, rather than becoming reliant on both partners working flat out - a situation which is unfair to single people, and particularly single parents, even before you factor in the pay inequality which obviously puts single females, and even more particularly single parent females, at an even greater disadvantage.

My original point, however, was to agree that pay inequality needs addressing, but say that it is not merely a single issue. It would be inherently unequal to equalize pay but still have society place the burden, expectation and label of 'breadwinner' upon men - not least because, as Siggy pointed out, not all breadwinners are men. (And which I already knew, to be honest, seeing as my gf earns significantly more than I manage to rake in.)


(* Note to self: stop stepping on landmines.)