same thoughts....could be as simple as Steve pouring his hurt into these relationships....he grew up without his Dad....maybe these are cloaked wishes....
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same thoughts....could be as simple as Steve pouring his hurt into these relationships....he grew up without his Dad....maybe these are cloaked wishes....
Exactly. Ben and Mark, too. "Everyone thought the man and boy were father and son". The beginning to 'Salem's Lot.Perhaps the desire to fill in what he lacked in his own childhood with his father? Show that such relationships can and do exist.
The realization that action was necessary, the attempt at something never done before, the failure to succeed. The acceptance ofA chilling moment was when Stu is operating on Mark (Perion's boyfriend) and he realizes (or is told) that Mark is dead. He becomes emotionally detached, shell shocked. Over and over he keeps saying, "Well, that's that." This is a beautiful but frightening scene. It illustrates how helpless they all are. Scary.
She’s kind of underly developed, I kind of forgot she was a character until she and Larry were partners. Not a bad side character but a little too underdeveloped for me to care that much about her romance with Larry.What is your opinion of Lucy Swann? Do you think it took Larry a long time to forget about Nadine? I wasn't initially convinced that Lucy and Larry had any kind of meaningful relationship. Obviously this changes by Part Three, but what did you guys think? She was a character I didn't immediately click with.
Lucy was a survivor- having lost her family. A thought could be that with her survival instincts, the need for companionship was a necessity. Thus pairing up with Larry and developing into a relationship. I do feel Larry took a long time getting over Nadine. It may have been an insecurity on his part.What is your opinion of Lucy Swann? Do you think it took Larry a long time to forget about Nadine? I wasn't initially convinced that Lucy and Larry had any kind of meaningful relationship. Obviously this changes by Part Three, but what did you guys think? She was a character I didn't immediately click with.
Yeah, we are given more backstory (and more time with) other ancillary characters; this could be the problem. Once Lucy is active in Boulder, we see Larry fall for her but it's almost perfunctory. Again, by the end I liked her more and my feelings were stronger.She’s kind of underly developed, I kind of forgot she was a character until she and Larry were partners. Not a bad side character but a little too underdeveloped for me to care that much about her romance with Larry.
I think Lucy is a quiet character, yet a strong one because she IS who Larry needs. She helps ground him and see there is more to life than being a self centered cad all the time. Larry knew that before Lucy in his heart, but he could not seem to make it into any kind of reality.What is your opinion of Lucy Swann? Do you think it took Larry a long time to forget about Nadine? I wasn't initially convinced that Lucy and Larry had any kind of meaningful relationship. Obviously this changes by Part Three, but what did you guys think? She was a character I didn't immediately click with.
Yeah, and I did appreciate the drama that was created when Lucy joined Larry's group. It didn't take long for there to be friction between Lucy and Nadine.Lucy was a survivor- having lost her family. A thought could be that with her survival instincts, the need for companionship was a necessity. Thus pairing up with Larry and developing into a relationship. I do feel Larry took a long time getting over Nadine. It may have been an insecurity on his part.
This was my idea of her, too. Larry genuinely cared for her but I think it was mostly animal attraction and a lustful desire. Lucy loved him. Nadine loved nobody...not even Joe/Leo. (Nadine was a teacher and cared for Joe, obviously, but she was on a collision course and fighting a losing battle in her soul.)Nadine is like the sexy pin up in my mind.
I know I’m crossing over into act three territory with this but speaking of Nadine Cross...This was my idea of her, too. Larry genuinely cared for her but I think it was mostly animal attraction and a lustful desire. Lucy loved him. Nadine loved nobody...not even Joe/Leo. (Nadine was a teacher and cared for Joe, obviously, but she was on a collision course and fighting a losing battle in her soul.)
Panda, those are excellent points. I agree with you on the fateful trajectories of Nadine and Harold.I know I’m crossing over into act three territory with this but speaking of Nadine Cross...I feel the way Nadine dies is really anticlimactic to her final goal, the whole birthing Randall’s spawn thing. She goes out of her way to get there only to end up being thrown to her death by Flaggy himself. She’s an interesting character but far outshined in the traitor/mental decline category by Harold. I believe Harold is a perfect example of how to write a traitorous/morally declining character while Nadine feels a bit more empty to me, like a more hollow character. Like Harold her character is practically doomed from the start, but I feel Harold has a more realistic and human decline in sanity/morals, he tries to do good in the beginning, but his self destructive personality traits plus his greedy lustful feelings towards Fran turn him into a truly human evil. He has an ending that sums up his arc and he’s able to feel genuine regret about how he acted towards and the horrible things he did towards people who cared about him, his ending feels genuinely upsetting because he’s able to be remorseful and guilty in it which allows for the reader to not forgive him but understand and feel for him, Nadine’s demise is more quick and out of the blue and doesn’t leave much room for feeling.
Yes King is amazing at allowing stories to be fresh and surprising, even books I really enjoy don’t always know the appropriate moment to put a shocking twistPanda, those are excellent points. I agree with you on the fateful trajectories of Nadine and Harold.
Yeah, Harold wasn't the doomed figure like Nadine turned out to be. In regard to Nadine's anticlimactic demise (dramatic but not meaningful, maybe), I have come to forgive (and even appreciate) particular narratives that fizzle out or defy traditional expectations. King has said he often has no idea where the story is taking him, and this might be the element of danger and surprise I seldom find in other authors. Yes, there are wonderful stylists and writers who emulate the grand design in Shakespeare and Greek mythology, but there is something to be said for spontaneity in a novel, even when a character's story becomes somewhat nonsensical or loses its emotional impact. It may sound counterintuitive for a writer to practice this, but because King doesn't always know what will happen next, neither do we, and that is thrilling. His critics will occasionally accuse him of writing unwieldy, bloated stories, but he has captured lightning in a bottle too many times for him to suddenly distrust his instincts.
I think chapter 61 begins the last book.I was late for part one but read the entire book when the board was down. Then, since it was October movie marathon month, I immediately watched the mini-series when I was done with the book. I don't want to go astray here and start talking about the mini-series in the book thread but just want to mention how interesting it was to see what Stephen chose to truncate for the mini-series.
Now, I'm not one to usually point out small factual errors (like safeties on Glocks ) because I think it's kind of petty to expect the author to know everything but CHOCOLATE ON A PAYDAY? Come on
Maybe someone brought that up in the other thread. Since I haven't read the other thread, I better shut up and go read it before I post anymore and I need to look to see where book two ended so I don't say anything about book 3. To quote Arnold, "I'll be back"
Just swooping by right now. I'll add my thoughts tomorrow
I would be interested to hear your thoughts. Favorite moments, quotes, anything.I was late for part one but read the entire book when the board was down. Then, since it was October movie marathon month, I immediately watched the mini-series when I was done with the book. I don't want to go astray here and start talking about the mini-series in the book thread but just want to mention how interesting it was to see what Stephen chose to truncate for the mini-series.
Now, I'm not one to usually point out small factual errors (like safeties on Glocks ) because I think it's kind of petty to expect the author to know everything but CHOCOLATE ON A PAYDAY? Come on
Maybe someone brought that up in the other thread. Since I haven't read the other thread, I better shut up and go read it before I post anymore and I need to look to see where book two ended so I don't say anything about book 3. To quote Arnold, "I'll be back"