Group Discussion II: The Stand (40th Anniversary)

[Doc Creed]

Meet me here at 7pm (CST) for our continuing discussion of The Stand. We will be talking about Book Two. Everyone welcome. Please don't reply here until designated time. Thanks.


"The rats are in the corn."

 

[Doc Creed]

Almost that time. Here's some Za-Rex for everybody. Passing out fliers for the Free Zone Committee.


Coolallosaurus cat in a bag Tery Spideyman fljoe0 do1you9love? Nomik

 

[Doc Creed]

Welcome, everyone! This is an election day and a busy time of year in general but we will proceed and see who pops in.

Book Two is the main bulk of the novel (about 650 pages) where many of the characters meet and their lives intersect...sometimes literally. Nick meets Tom in the middle of the street; he thinks a dead man has arisen. The stories combine after Mother Abigail joins them en route to Boulder and huge events are set in motion. This section ends with a few deaths and a whole new quest for Larry, Glen, Stu, and Ralph...and Kojak. Any favorite parts? Thoughts?

I realized almost every character dreams of both Mother Abigail and The Dark Man, except for Nadine- she dreams only of him. I can't figure out why this is.

 

[Doc Creed]

Nick is still my favorite character. Here is a quote I liked. He has just moved into his house in Boulder.

"As he sat here with his felt-tip pens and paper, one of these books sat on the desk beside his right hand- Set This House On Fire, by William Styron. He had marked his place with a ten-dollar bill he had found on the street. There was a lot of money in the streets, blowing along the gutters in the wind, and he was still surprised and amused at how many people- himself among them- still stopped to pick them up. And why? The books were free now. The ideas were free. Sometimes that thought exhilarated him. Sometimes it frightened him."

 

[GNTLGNT]

Welcome, everyone! This is an election day and a busy time of year in general but we will proceed and see who pops in.

Book Two is the main bulk of the novel (about 650 pages) where many of the characters meet and their lives intersect...sometimes literally. Nick meets Tom in the middle of the street; he thinks a dead man has arisen. The stories combine after Mother Abigail joins them en route to Boulder and huge events are set in motion. This section ends with a few deaths and a whole new quest for Larry, Glen, Stu, and Ralph...and Kojak. Any favorite parts? Thoughts?

I realized almost every character dreams of both Mother Abigail and The Dark Man, except for Nadine- she dreams only of him. I can't figure out why this is.

...the “Scouts” always riveted me....and the “pursuit crow”.....also the inner eye trope was well twisted for this tale....

 

[GNTLGNT]

Nick is still my favorite character. Here is a quote I liked. He has just moved into his house in Boulder.

"As he sat here with his felt-tip pens and paper, one of these books sat on the desk beside his right hand- Set This House On Fire, by William Styron. He had marked his place with a ten-dollar bill he had found on the street. There was a lot of money in the streets, blowing along the gutters in the wind, and he was still surprised and amused at how many people- himself among them- still stopped to pick them up. And why? The books were free now. The ideas were free. Sometimes that thought exhilarated him. Sometimes it frightened him."

...so many truly philosophical moments, it’s almost magical...

 

[Spideyman]

Hi Doc Creed , and thank you for leading this group.
Well, I have to say Kojak is my favorite character. Furry ones count, right!

Many parts speak out to me. As you said the ways individuals, adding on became groups as they traveled. The friendship that arose. Basic trusts and caring, common good.

 

[Doc Creed]

A new thought occurred to me this time. First a quote: "Acts was the last book in the bible where doctrine was backed up by miracles, and what were miracles but the divine hand of God at work upon the earth?" (Page 890 of uncut pbk)

This may allude to the controversial ending, a gargantuan deus ex machina, where the hand of God comes down. I will pay close attention to that part when I get to it this time. I'm wondering if the characters see it in their mind's eye or if it is literal. I'm thinking it was literal, right? Anyway, that may hold off for Book Three discussion.

 

[cat in a bag]

Part 2 is where we see Larry become a good man. He is such a favorite of mine.

One thing that really stuck out to me this time around was the doubts certain characters felt about Mother Abigail. After she disappears. Stu and Glen in particular. Like they almost wished she would stay gone. They appreciated what she had done for them so far but felt they were good going forward. I never really picked up on that before, I don't think.

The events at the end of pt 2 are brutal. I wish some more communication had been had between key players, they could have figured it out and stopped it. But, that would change the story, wouldn't it?

Just a few thought from the top of my head.

 

[GNTLGNT]

A new thought occurred to me this time. First a quote: "Acts was the last book in the bible where doctrine was backed up by miracles, and what were miracles but the divine hand of God at work upon the earth?" (Page 890 of uncut pbk)

This may allude to the controversial ending, a gargantuan deus ex machina, where the hand of God comes down. I will pay close attention to that part when I get to it this time. I'm wondering if the characters see it in their mind's eye or if it is literal. I'm thinking it was literal, right? Anyway, that may hold off for Book Three discussion.

...literal kind sir....literal....

 

[GNTLGNT]

Part 2 is where we see Larry become a good man. He is such a favorite of mine.

One thing that really stuck out to me this time around was the doubts certain characters felt about Mother Abigail. After she disappears. Stu and Glen in particular. Like they almost wished she would stay gone. They appreciated what she had done for them so far but felt they were good going forward. I never really picked up on that before, I don't think.

The events at the end of pt 2 are brutal. I wish some more communication had been had between key players, they could have figured it out and stopped it. But, that would change the story, wouldn't it?

Just a few thought from the top of my head.

...Mother had almost become an ox yoke around the collective neck of the Free Zone....

 

[Doc Creed]

...so many truly philosophical moments, it’s almost magical...

Hi Doc Creed , and thank you for leading this group.
Well, I have to say Kojak is my favorite character. Furry ones count, right!

Many parts speak out to me. As you said the ways individuals, adding on became groups as they traveled. The friendship that arose. Basic trusts and caring, common good.

Yes, it really is...and of course furry ones count.

Larry meeting Nadine and Joe is well written. Feels real. Joe is a peculiar character and I don't think it is fully explained why he behaves as he does. At first, he's feral, homicidal...but later he calms down. I even wondered if he was on the Autism Spectrum.

 

[GNTLGNT]

Yes, it really is...and of course furry ones count.

Larry meeting Nadine and Joe is well written. Feels real. Joe is a peculiar character and I don't think it is fully explained why he behaves as he does. At first, he's feral, homicidal...but later he calms down. I even wondered if he was on the Autism Spectrum.

...that’s what I came to believe as well....

 

[Doc Creed]

Part 2 is where we see Larry become a good man. He is such a favorite of mine.

One thing that really stuck out to me this time around was the doubts certain characters felt about Mother Abigail. After she disappears. Stu and Glen in particular. Like they almost wished she would stay gone. They appreciated what she had done for them so far but felt they were good going forward. I never really picked up on that before, I don't think.

The events at the end of pt 2 are brutal. I wish some more communication had been had between key players, they could have figured it out and stopped it. But, that would change the story, wouldn't it?

Just a few thought from the top of my head.

Yeah, great point. Some revered her, some were ambivalent toward her, and some hated her in some ways. Frannie calls her a demon...but I think this was in anger because of what she demanded (asked?) Stu and others do. This fell hard on the loss of Nick, too.

 

[cat in a bag]

Yes, it really is...and of course furry ones count.

Larry meeting Nadine and Joe is well written. Feels real. Joe is a peculiar character and I don't think it is fully explained why he behaves as he does. At first, he's feral, homicidal...but later he calms down. I even wondered if he was on the Autism Spectrum.

Yep. I think so too. Partly because of trauma but his proficiency with music is what makes me think at least a little bit autistic. I hate Nadine almost more for how she treated Joe than for her involvement with Harold and everything that happens.

 

[Doc Creed]

...Mother had almost become an ox yoke around the collective neck of the Free Zone....

That's a great way to phrase it. You're right. Maybe she knew her part was done. Though she did think she'd sinned against God with pride. Interesting.

 

[Doc Creed]

proficiency with music

Exactly. Did you think he liked to sit by himself or be alone (in parts) added to this diagnosis? He played the guitar by himself sometimes, too. I don't know.

 

[Doc Creed]

I don't really hate Nadine or Harold. Each time I read it I see their stories are tragically predestined somehow...like Judas Iscariot's. Harold writes this in his journal: "My letters to the world/which never wrote to me". Sad loner. He was given opportunities, though, but he rejected them.

 

[GNTLGNT]

Exactly. Did you think he liked to sit by himself or be alone (in parts) added to this diagnosis? He played the guitar by himself sometimes, too. I don't know.

...his own self-discovered therapy....it’s a soothing behavior....

 

[cat in a bag]

Exactly. Did you think he liked to sit by himself or be alone (in parts) added to this diagnosis? He played the guitar by himself sometimes, too. I don't know.

I do think his alone time is also indicative BUT I also feel that music, Larry and the guitar is what broke him out of his shell. I do think he shows some tendencies but yet the music brought him around. Led him to trust Larry. Larry and the guitar and the music helped him to decide to survive in my mind.