Elba's Casting CONFIRMED?!!

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ThomasWinter

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So I typed into google: 'How tall is Stephen King" and the answer was 1.93m which is 6 foot and 3 inches which is incorrect.
Then I typed in : how tall is Idris Elba and got 1.9 meters which is 6 foot 2 inches, now Roland was based on 'The Man with no name' so he should be 6 foot 5 inches.
Now I typed in: how tall is Tom Cruise? Answer: 1.7m which is 5 foot 5, but Jack Reacher is 6 foot 5. So height has nothing to do with who plays a character. Colour of skin shouldn't either unless it totally ruins the storyline or makes the story ridiculous. I would have reversed the roles and have Elba as Walter and McConaughey as Roland.

Jack Reacher fans were outraged about Cruise portraying him. In the Jack Reacher books, his intimidating physical stature and strength is brought up numerous times. I will say that the first Jack Reacher film was still very enjoyable despite the change. It added a different element of guys underestimating him when it came to fighting instead of guys seeing him and being immediately intimidated.
 

OldDarth

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I wager that Elba being cast as Roland will be the least divisive aspect of the movie when it comes out. We're very fortunate to get not just one, but two, great actors in an adaptation of a Stephen King work.
 
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Robert Gray

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Forrest Gump another example. Eric Roth took a horrible book by Winston Groom and made it the fun fabulous movie we saw on the big screen.

Yes but in almost every case where the film substantially changes the book for the better, you are talking about Hollywood taking a mediocre to bad book (which had a kernel of a good idea) and then just rewriting the idea better. You see this with the Dexter series, Game of Thrones (let's be honest the books are poorly written), Forrest Gump, and so on into eternity. When Hollywood takes on good (or excellent) book they almost always fail. It really comes down to intent more than anything else. In short, WHY are they doing rewrites? Cinematographers who are true fans of a work, and thus want to translate it to the screen, tend to make changes only when they must. These tend to be the success stories. Most of the time the rewrites are done simply because those making the pictures either think they can tell the story better (arrogance) or simply because they only wanted the name of the book in the first place for marketing purposes.

This is particularly true when big hits apply. While we are veering into the realm of "graphic novels" one need only look at "The League of Extraordinary Gentleman," by Allan Moore. This work is on par in quality with any pure literary work. It is incisive, dark (at times funny), and perfect. Not a single world is excessive or could be cut. Moreover, as a graphic novel it was already in storyboard form. It was just the right length for a film. Making it into a film should have been a piece of cake with so much of the prep of production done. It was not to be. Hollywood wanted the title due to the fandom Moore generates, but didn't want (or look at from what I can tell) the graphic novel itself. The story they wrote and put on screen has only the names of some characters in common. It boggles the mind.
 

OldDarth

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A straight adaptation of the DT books - especially The Gunslinger - would be a cinematic box office bomb. The average moviegoer would see it as a western and westerns don't make big bucks at Box Office anymore. I believe reworking the books, and making them a sequel too - very clever to boot, to give moviegoers an understandable frame of reference with NYC is a good idea. This allows the focus to be on the characters hopefully allowing the audience to connect to them. If the first movie is successful in doing that, then the audience will be willing to follow Roland and his ka-tet wherever they go, no matter how weird or meta.

If the books were being made into a TV mini-series then a straight adaptation would have a greater chance of success.

Plus there's a fair amount of material in the 7 books that is not needed. For example, dropping Mordred wouldn't bother me at all.
 
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Robert Gray

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A straight adaptation of the DT books - especially The Gunslinger - would be a cinematic box office bomb. The average moviegoer would see it as a western and westerns don't make big bucks at Box Office anymore. I believe reworking the books, and making them a sequel too - very clever to boot, to give moviegoers an understandable frame of reference with NYC is a good idea. This allows the focus to be on the characters hopefully allowing the audience to connect to them. If the first movie is successful in doing that, then the audience will be willing to follow Roland and his ka-tet wherever they go, no matter how weird or meta.

If the books were being made into a TV mini-series then a straight adaptation would have a greater chance of success.

Plus there's a fair amount of material in the 7 books that is not needed. For example, dropping Mordred wouldn't bother me at all.

We will have to agree to disagree, passionately. First, no one would assume a properly promoted Gunslinger is a western. King's name and the nature of the series is well know. Advertisements, posters, and trailers would make it abundantly clear that it isn't just a Western. You and I differ in that you seem to have a low opinion of people, whereas I think people are starved for good fiction, not to mention something that is truly new and different. That is not what we are going to see in this upcoming movie (more is the pity).

Moreover, I don't think there is any material that isn't needed. The notion of cutting Mordred seems bizarre beyond imagining. To do that you would be gutting not just that character but a great deal of the motivation and conflict of the later books. It would also remove the cyclical nature of the overlay of Arthurian legend. Without Mordred there is no Song of Susannah. It literally would remove huge chunks from the Wolves of the Calla too. Mordred isn't just Mordred; he is conflict and drive for primary characters that matter.
 

OldDarth

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As you say, we'll have to passionately agree to disagree. Especially on the opinions of other people.

The economics of movie making are not viable for the sort of adaptation you are proposing. An approach much more viable for TV or streaming services.


Long days & pleasant nights!
 
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mjs9153

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Heehee,I have to laugh..Game of Thrones,Forrest Gump,etc are poorly written? I like your insights on IT Robert Gray,but are you a published author? Poorly written..I guess those who can,do,and those who can't,criticise..perhaps you should tell those authors to return their paychecks,they are poor examples of writing.. :eyebrow:
 
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Dana Jean

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Heehee,I have to laugh..Game of Thrones,Forrest Gump,etc are poorly written? I like your insights on IT Robert Gray,but are you a published author? Poorly written..I guess those who can,do,and those who can't,criticise..perhaps you should tell those authors to return their paychecks,they are poor examples of writing.. :eyebrow:
Have you read Forrest Gump? It is horrible. Again, the wonderful screenwriter Eric Roth deserves Winston Groom's paychecks.
 

mjs9153

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Have you read Forrest Gump? It is horrible. Again, the wonderful screenwriter Eric Roth deserves Winston Groom's paychecks.
No I haven't but I respect a published author.. perhaps the reader is not understanding the written intent.
 
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Robert Gray

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Heehee,I have to laugh..Game of Thrones,Forrest Gump,etc are poorly written? I like your insights on IT Robert Gray,but are you a published author? Poorly written..I guess those who can,do,and those who can't,criticise..perhaps you should tell those authors to return their paychecks,they are poor examples of writing.. :eyebrow:

Yes, they poorly written. Sometimes they are technically poor, and sometimes it is just downright bad storytelling. The Game of Thrones books are painful to try and read. The books upon which the Dexter series are based are not only technically poor but also repugnant. There is a difference between a novel's success and its quality. The awful Twilight books are the worst sort of drivel, and the monetary success of the franchise doesn't change that. Fifty Shades of Grey is also very successful but total rubbish. If I comment on a particular book, you can rest-assured that I've read it, and in the case of some of these we have mentioned here, suffered through cover to cover. Are you saying that you think the books in the Game of Thrones series are well-written? Have you read Forrest Gump by Groom? For the record, my writing gets critiqued on regular basis; it comes with the territory. I do believe that those who dish it out should be able to take it.
 
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mjs9153

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Yes, they poorly written. Sometimes they technically poor, and sometimes it is just downright bad storytelling. The Game of Thrones books are painful to try and read. The books upon which the Dexter series are based are not only technically poor but also repugnant. There is a difference between a novel's success and its quality. The awful Twilight books are the worst sort of drivel, and the monetary success of the franchise doesn't change that. The Fifty Shades of Grey is also successful but total rubbish. If I comment on a particular book, you can rest-assured that I've read it, and in the case of some of these we have mentioned here, suffered through cover to cover. Are you saying that you think the books in the Game of Thrones series are well-written? Have you read Forrest Gump by Groom? For the record, my writing gets critiqued on regular basis; it comes with the territory. I do believe that those who dish it out should be able to take it.
Fair point.. And yet somehow these works were successful. The authors found their niche and were able to be successful, which is saying quite a lot in a book market that is crowded and difficult to get published in. And for the record I have not read either of these works, it just struck me funny that somebody would criticize something so successful.. on the other hand I guess the pet rock was successful too so you may have a point..
 
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Robert Gray

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Fair point.. And yet somehow these works were successful. The authors found their niche and were able to be successful, which is saying quite a lot in a book market that is crowded and difficult to get published in. And for the record I have not read either of these works, it just struck me funny that somebody would criticize something so successful.. on the other hand I guess the pet rock was successful too so you may have a point..

Yep. The Pet Rock was successful. The Shake Weight made someone an obscene amount of money just recently too. In the realm of commercial fiction, success is quite often about marketing or simply having an interesting idea that gets optioned to film. A movie will often make a published work that is not successful into a powerhouse. Modern social media can turn horrible fan fiction or whatever the heck you want to call Fifty Shades of Grey into a book. My only real point is that financial success shouldn't be a pass on critical reception or critical thinking. Likewise an obscure work which doesn't get promotion or become well-known isn't necessarily a failure. Thousands of great books are written every year but have to compete for limited slots, many of which Publishers fill with things they are gambling on based on marketing merits rather than the literary. I learn more from the bad books I read than the good ones, which is why I suffer through them. I wish I could say that it is the books I love that improve my writing (and I'm sure to a degree they do), but it is those downright terrible ones that remind me of what not to do. It is the very fact that something like Twilight made some twit rich that I keep pounding the keys.
 

mjs9153

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BTW-I'm sorry if this came off wrong, I don't know what came over me to horn in on your conversation.. I just have not been doing well lately... My apologies
 

Robert Gray

Well-Known Member
BTW-I'm sorry if this came off wrong, I don't know what came over me to horn in on your conversation.. I just have not been doing well lately... My apologies

You have no reason to apologize, nor can you horn in on a conversation. This a forum and that is what we are here to do. Just because we disagree (and you voiced your thoughts) doesn't mean it isn't a valid stance. In fact, I think discussing the literary merits of various books is actually far more important to this site than any of the many other discussions. The issue of success versus quality is a longstanding one. Don't let my overt, sometimes overly lengthy responses drive you off or make you feel unwelcome.
 

Dana Jean

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No I haven't but I respect a published author.. perhaps the reader is not understanding the written intent.
I understand suck when I read suck.

The idea was there, Eric Roth, a respected screenwriter made the magic.

No one even heard of Winston Groom until the movie, and then the book sold.
 

Dana Jean

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BTW-I'm sorry if this came off wrong, I don't know what came over me to horn in on your conversation.. I just have not been doing well lately... My apologies
Sorry you aren't doing well. Hope things get better.

Get the book and read it. I'm assuming you have seen the movie. I'd love to hear your opinion after.
 
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mjs9153

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Sorry you aren't doing well. Hope things get better.

Get the book and read it. I'm assuming you have seen the movie. I'd love to hear your opinion after.
That's okay Dana,I suffered a loss recently and it has me all over the place.. Happy sometimes,angry sometimes,sad sometimes.. It's like I'm ping ponging all over the place. Just the normal grief process I suppose, so sometimes I react without thinking. It will be okay though..I did read one of Winston Groom's books though and I didn't particularly care for it,and that was one that was supposed to be decent.. I tend to stick with what I like I guess. Thank you both for the kind words..
 

Dana Jean

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That's okay Dana,I suffered a loss recently and it has me all over the place.. Happy sometimes,angry sometimes,sad sometimes.. It's like I'm ping ponging all over the place. Just the normal grief process I suppose, so sometimes I react without thinking. It will be okay though..I did read one of Winston Groom's books though and I didn't particularly care for it,and that was one that was supposed to be decent.. I tend to stick with what I like I guess. Thank you both for the kind words..
I know you lost your brother. Sometimes it takes a long time to find some peace. I hope you do soon because it hurts to carry that sorrow.

And I say read Forrest Gump sincerely. I just absolutely loathed it, but you may find some redeeming qualities that I should take a second look at. I am not commenting on the mechanics of his writing, just the story. I loved the movie so much, maybe I just didn't give the book a chance.
 

Spideyman

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That's okay Dana,I suffered a loss recently and it has me all over the place.. Happy sometimes,angry sometimes,sad sometimes.. It's like I'm ping ponging all over the place. Just the normal grief process I suppose, so sometimes I react without thinking. It will be okay though..I did read one of Winston Groom's books though and I didn't particularly care for it,and that was one that was supposed to be decent.. I tend to stick with what I like I guess. Thank you both for the kind words..
Grieving process can take time--- give yourself that time. Holding you in positive vibes. Love and green lights!