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Hypothetical "what if's" and a question

Discussion in '11/22/63' started by KD_Canadian, Jan 25, 2016.

  1. KD_Canadian

    KD_Canadian New Member

    Hi everyone,

    I'm new here and just finished reading this fabulous book.

    With all of Jake and Al's travels up and down the Rabbit Hole, I started wondering...

    #1: Let's say Jake goes down the Rabbit Hole while Al is hanging out in his diner. Then for whatever reason, Al goes down the Rabbit Hole while Jake is still there. Since Al has caused a reset, does that mean Jake simply ceases to exist?

    #2: No matter how much time passes in the past, only two minutes elapse in the present time while Jake is down the Rabbit Hole. Which means that when Jake went down the first time he killed Frank Dunning, Al was only waiting for him for two minutes. But what if Frank had killed Jake? Would Al see the time tick past the two minute mark and realize something was wrong?

    #3: If Jake had decided to forget about saving JFK and just live in the past with Sadie, there would eventually be two Jakes when his date of birth rolled around. And then what? Jake II would meet Al and be recruited to save JFK (since Jake I decided not to). What would happen if Jake I and Jake II ran into each other in the past?

    Those are my hypotheticals - forgive me if I'm overthinking this.

    Now, my question. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the meaning of the alternative 2011 that Jake returns to. I *think* he finds that the world has gone to **** not because of JFK living, but because all the trips down the Rabbit Hole have destroyed reality. If that is the case, how is it that Jake was able to put things right by yet another trip down the Rabbit Hole? Wouldn't that just create another string and hasten the end of the world?
  2. Dana Jean

    Dana Jean Reformed Dirty Pirate Hooker Moderator

    footsteps, Doc Creed, GNTLGNT and 2 others like this.
  3. KD_Canadian

    KD_Canadian New Member

    And I just realized that my hypothetical #3 wouldn't happen because of the reset. But we could invert that: Jake I could stay in the past with Sadie, and eventually run into a much younger Jake II in the present/future.
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  4. Spideyman

    Spideyman Uber Member

    Hi and welcome.
    GNTLGNT likes this.

    SHEEMIEE Well-Known Member


    I reckon the rabbit hole would prevent anybody else going through if it is 'occupied' - giving the user his two minutes of life or death scenarios - then change to 'unoccupied' -thus resetting the previous players game to original .

    Great question . Btw
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  6. Anduan Pirate Princess

    Anduan Pirate Princess Well-Known Member

    Hi and welcome! I love your ideas. This book is so great because of all the thinking it makes you do. It stays with you long after the reading part is over. :)
    Doc Creed, Spideyman and GNTLGNT like this.

    GNTLGNT The idiot is IN

    [QUOTE]With all of Jake and Al's travels up and down the Rabbit Hole[/QUOTE]
    ...I'm sorry, I giggled at this like the teen boy I still am.....in my head anyway.....
  8. The Nameless

    The Nameless M-O-O-N - That spells Nameless

    Welcome to the boards. I would say that:

    1, My head hurts trying to answer this.

    2, I believe that Al would indeed know after the 2 minutes passed without Jake's return, and if he died in the past then he would just be another missing person in the present.

    3, In 2011, Jake I is 35 and so by the time Jake II is 35 in 2011, Jake I will be 88 so probably dead from old age anyway. But if they do meet each other, I don't think anything would happen.

    With regards to your real question, I think I would have to read it again - it's been over a year since I last read it.
  9. Lockdain

    Lockdain I wrestled a bear once!

    Hello and welcome! You did a great conclusions, i admire!

    #1. This question sounds great btw. Ok, so let's imagine, that i'm Jake. I passed through the Rabbit Hole and now i'm in 1958. It was written, that the Rabbit Hole sends you in the same place and time in 1958. So, i passed through it and have been walking around for 2 hrs. It's now 1:30 pm. Now Al decided to pass down the hole. He would be land in the same place i did, but two hours earlier then me. Now it's a crossroad:
    1st case: I'll be annihilated by the reset since Al entered the Rabbit Hole. But when will it happen? We remember, that Al will be there two hours earlier. So, in this case - if Al will pass through the hole after you, you would never get to the past and time will immediately kill you, because in case Al comes after you he'll get to the future earlier anyway and cause the reset. (SIC)
    2st case: Since Al entered the Rabbit Hole a new time string was created. Now Al lives in alternative timeline and he will never face me in 1958, it's kinda of i land in a junk time line, which possibly leads to nowhere. Or leads to time-space collapse.
    3st case: Since the Rabbit Hole leads to a certain time in the past, and one, who entered the hole later, becomes in future earlier, i will walking alone for 2 hrs, but when Al had passed through the hole, i'd suddenly realized that i was together with Al for the last two hours, and i'd never recall, that i was alone there for some time, because this time string was never existed. (SIC)

    #2. I think in such case Al wouldn't notice any changes at all, because everything, what's being connected to Jake, should remain. It is similar to a case if Jake would be killed by gangsters on his way home. After two minutes Al wouldn't notice anything. Because time travel takes only 2 mins in 2011, Al couldn't say if Jake decided to stay at the past or being killed by smb. In case Jake perefered to stay - Al could try to find him in 2011, he should be at least 80 y.o. and ask him about what happened. If Al wouldn't finds him in 2011 - that means Jake was killed and it might be described in the newspapers.

    #3. It'is that what Jake feared at most. A kinda of Time Paradox. It could lead to time collapse in a result, that is why Jake decided to turn back.

    Sorry for my english, it's hard for me to explain those difficult situations.
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2016
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  10. Arkay Lynchpin

    Arkay Lynchpin Preserve wildlife, pickle a squirrel.

    What if Jake is just making his way through "other worlds than these" and changed his surname to suit?
    jcadams, GNTLGNT and Lockdain like this.
  11. mal

    mal Well-Known Member

    Howdy KD_Canadian! Yes, you are overthinking.=D Cool, interesting, hypothetical questions however. I usually suspend my belief when reading these types of time travel scenarios, and in daily normal life as well. All the best, mal.
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  12. Aloysius Nell

    Aloysius Nell Well-Known Member

    No disrespect to Stephen King, but y'all realize he's not a quantum physicist, right? He's just guessing about time travel like 100% of authors do. Actually, like 100% of scientists do, too.

    It's made up. It's fiction. That's why it works the way it does - just because it does!
  13. The Nameless

    The Nameless M-O-O-N - That spells Nameless

    Yeah, we all know that, that's what puts us all in the same boat. It makes everyone perfectly suited to ask and answer hypothetical questions - if it's something that can't be answered, we're all both right and wrong at the same time. We're not having a pop at his work or anything (at least I'm not), 11/22/63 is only behind IT as my favourite book. I personally love the fact that King doesn't explain why weird things are the way they are, he just says "this is the way it is - like it or leave it".
    GNTLGNT, Aloysius Nell and Spideyman like this.
  14. staropeace

    staropeace Richard Bachman's love child

    Oh my poor head!
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  15. king family fan

    king family fan Prolific member

  16. KD_Canadian

    KD_Canadian New Member

    Thanks for all the welcomes and responses!

    Just to clarify - my hypothetical questions are not intended in any way to be criticisms. Just that this kind of writing makes me think. It was the same when I read "The Time Traveler's Wife" (loved the book, hated the movie).

    My next question is this: what other SK books are similar to this one in terms of genre? I'm not a fan of the kind of horror that makes you think an alien is going to eat your brains with an ice cream scoop while you sleep. I haven't read a lot of SK - I'm looking for the more suspenseful, thought-provoking stuff. Any suggestions?
    GNTLGNT likes this.
  17. Aloysius Nell

    Aloysius Nell Well-Known Member

    In No Particular Order:

    Green Mile
    Different Seasons
    Dark Tower series
    Mr. Mercedes and Finders Keepers
    The Talisman and Black House
    Dolores Claiborne

    That ought to keep you busy for a while!
    GNTLGNT likes this.
  18. KD_Canadian

    KD_Canadian New Member

    Thank you for the suggestions! I've read The Green Mile (and loved it) but none of the others. I'll check them out!
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  19. Neesy

    Neesy #1 fan (Annie Wilkes cousin) 1st cousin Mom's side

    I know!

    I never even saw this thread until today. So just to lighten up things a bit, here is a recipe similar to the one in the back of the book:

    bookcooker: Eggnog Poundcake and Stephen King's 11/22/63


    This recipe is actually a bit heavy for the summer time, but it might be nice with a cup of hot tea!
  20. Neesy

    Neesy #1 fan (Annie Wilkes cousin) 1st cousin Mom's side

    Hey mal - maybe try my recipe for pound cake [post # 19] (or get the wife to bake it!) - ew - I hope that did not sound too sexist :a24: :a11: :m_pan: (Have you ever noticed she seems to be cooking a tiny monkey in that frying pan?)
    mal likes this.

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