RE: Short Story Question (help?)

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Ebdim9th

Dressing the Gothic interval in tritones
Jul 1, 2009
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22,082
It's really sort of a joke, is it a chord possible to play, or isn't it? I borrowed it from a TV show ... I've seen a lot of opinions about it over the years, and you've added a new wrinkle .... I found a couple of chord sites that talk about it on the piano, but none of them called it an add 9, just a diminished 9th, so I'm only going by the theory I read up until now...
 

Maddie

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
Jul 10, 2006
4,945
9,345
that dollhouse at the end of the street
Hello Maddie,


I think there is also a kiddies film called Ghost Ship that came out about 10 x years ago (obviously I am not interested in that one!)?

Paul
Hello Maddie,

Thank you very much for digging!

I think there is also a kiddies film called Ghost Ship that came out about 10 x years ago (obviously I am not interested in that one!)?

Paul
Hi Paul,

You're welcome. Well, If youre sure about that kiddie Ghost Ship
Maddie can find it!

I will keep an eye out for the other one. :grinning:
 

monsterjazzlicks

Well-Known Member
Apr 10, 2017
65
234
Wirral, UK
It's really sort of a joke, is it a chord possible to play, or isn't it? I borrowed it from a TV show ... I've seen a lot of opinions about it over the years, and you've added a new wrinkle .... I found a couple of chord sites that talk about it on the piano, but none of them called it an add 9, just a diminished 9th, so I'm only going by the theory I read up until now...
Hi,

E flat diminished with a flattened ninth reads (upwards):

Eb, Gb, A, C, Fbb;​

and E flat diminished reads (upwards):

Eb, Gb, A, C, Eb.​

Note, Fbb and Eb are the same note (enharmonically)! Its that same as naming a chord: 'C5 (b11)'. The 'b11' is the same note (enharmonically) as 'E'. Therefore, the chord is simply a 'C Major' triad!

At the end of the day it all depends on what exactly the chord IS you are intending to describe.

If you mean, rather, a dominant seventh with a flattened ninth, then the spelling should read:

'Eb7 (b9)'.​

Or if you are meaning a diminished seventh with the inclusion of a ninth.dominant seventh with a flattened ninth then the spelling should read:

'Eb dim (add 9)'.​

Hope that helps . . .

Paul
 

Maddie

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
Jul 10, 2006
4,945
9,345
that dollhouse at the end of the street
Hi,

E flat diminished with a flattened ninth reads (upwards):

Eb, Gb, A, C, Fbb;​

and E flat diminished reads (upwards):

Eb, Gb, A, C, Eb.​

Note, Fbb and Eb are the same note (enharmonically)! Its that same as naming a chord: 'C5 (b11)'. The 'b11' is the same note (enharmonically) as 'E'. Therefore, the chord is simply a 'C Major' triad!

At the end of the day it all depends on what exactly the chord IS you are intending to describe.

If you mean, rather, a dominant seventh with a flattened ninth, then the spelling should read:

'Eb7 (b9)'.​

Or if you are meaning a diminished seventh with the inclusion of a ninth.dominant seventh with a flattened ninth then the spelling should read:

'Eb dim (add 9)'.​

Hope that helps . . .

Paul

Oh you guys are brilliant! Well Beethoven might have loved it? If it didn't exist before, it has now been Created, the proof lies within Google, and the Ebdim9th must take a bow. :victorious:
 

monsterjazzlicks

Well-Known Member
Apr 10, 2017
65
234
Wirral, UK
Oh you guys are brilliant! Well Beethoven might have loved it? If it didn't exist before, it has now been Created, the proof lies within Google, and the Ebdim9th must take a bow. :victorious:
Good evening Maddie,

Ha ha . . . I don't know about being "brilliant"!

Yes, Beethoven loved the 'diminished' chord. If fact, it was one of the most dramatic components of his vocabulary!

Ta,

Paul
 

Ebdim9th

Dressing the Gothic interval in tritones
Jul 1, 2009
6,132
22,082
Hi,

E flat diminished with a flattened ninth reads (upwards):

Eb, Gb, A, C, Fbb;​

and E flat diminished reads (upwards):

Eb, Gb, A, C, Eb.​

Note, Fbb and Eb are the same note (enharmonically)! Its that same as naming a chord: 'C5 (b11)'. The 'b11' is the same note (enharmonically) as 'E'. Therefore, the chord is simply a 'C Major' triad!

At the end of the day it all depends on what exactly the chord IS you are intending to describe.

If you mean, rather, a dominant seventh with a flattened ninth, then the spelling should read:

'Eb7 (b9)'.​

Or if you are meaning a diminished seventh with the inclusion of a ninth.dominant seventh with a flattened ninth then the spelling should read:

'Eb dim (add 9)'.​

Hope that helps . . .

Paul
Lol, wellll, yes and no. Despite conflicting opinions, I always did suspect that the point of the joke was about the 'impossible' or non-existent chord. After all, when he had a chance to actually use it, Joss Whedon, when composing "Give Me Something To Sing About" on Once More With Feeling, the musical episode of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, chose to use Eb dim 7th (or Cdim7th, depending on the context) instead.

So my posting name has never really had so much to do with the depths of music theorizing as it does this (BtVS season 2, What's My Line? Part 2) :

Willow stays behind with OZ - while Buffy heads toward the LAW ENFORCEMENT BOOTH.

OZ
Hey.

WILLOW
Hey . . .

OZ
Did you decide? Are you gonna become
a corporate computer suit guy?

WILLOW
Uh, I think I'm gonna finish high
school first. What about you?

OZ
I'm not really a computer person. Or
a work of any kind person.

WILLOW
Then why'd they select you?

OZ
I sort of test well. Which is cool,
except then it leads to jobs.

WILLOW
Well, don't you have some ambition?

OZ
Oh, yeah. E flat, diminished 9th.

WILLOW
Huh?

OZ
The E flat's doable, but it's that
diminished 9th . . . that's a man's
chord. You could lose a finger.

He smiles. Willow smiles too - not sure what to make of him.
 
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monsterjazzlicks

Well-Known Member
Apr 10, 2017
65
234
Wirral, UK
Lol, wellll, yes and no. Despite conflicting opinions, I always did suspect that the point of the joke was about the 'impossible' or non-existent chord. After all, when he had a chance to actually use it, Joss Whedon, when composing "Give Me Something To Sing About" on Once More With Feeling, the musical episode of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, chose to use Eb dim 7th (or Cdim7th, depending on the context) instead.
Hi,

I don't watch either of those programs but to me, it looks like the phrase a bit of a joke (maybe even an inside-joke).

I think the script writer (call him/her what you may) has deliberately included a term/description which is essentially nonsensical. I would imagine they got together with the Composer of the program to seek advice an to agree upon such a fitting term/description.

This type of dialogue is present throughout the history of films/TV - as you will obviously be aware of. For example, Sherlock Holmes, Doctor Who, etc often had their own unique idiosyncrasies which added a certain touch of humor and personalization to the script/character!

Ta,

Paul
 

Ebdim9th

Dressing the Gothic interval in tritones
Jul 1, 2009
6,132
22,082
Oh you guys are brilliant! Well Beethoven might have loved it? If it didn't exist before, it has now been Created, the proof lies within Google, and the Ebdim9th must take a bow. :victorious:
:love_heart: He's alive, alive I tell you! The chord is now a being, fluid and ambiguous, at least as far as haunting the halls of the internet is concerned, ghost notes :ghost: making their imprint, here, there, and elsewhere.....
 

Ebdim9th

Dressing the Gothic interval in tritones
Jul 1, 2009
6,132
22,082
Hi,

I don't watch either of those programs but to me, it looks like the phrase a bit of a joke (maybe even an inside-joke).

I think the script writer (call him/her what you may) has deliberately included a term/description which is essentially nonsensical. I would imagine they got together with the Composer of the program to seek advice an to agree upon such a fitting term/description.

This type of dialogue is present throughout the history of films/TV - as you will obviously be aware of. For example, Sherlock Holmes, Doctor Who, etc often had their own unique idiosyncrasies which added a certain touch of humor and personalization to the script/character!

Ta,

Paul
Idiosyncrasy of the character of Oz in this case, (based on the originator/author in part, as most characters often are, Joss Whedon, a composer himself,) being, as he admitted, allergic to work of any kind, including more advanced forms of music, beyond the slacker rock his group, Dingoes Ate My Baby, already played. ("So I'll put off the more complicated stuff for another day, maybe forever, by tossing in an imaginary/non-chord in there," {in there, that is the conversation, not what he actually bothered to play on guitar} is what I believe is implied in this dialogue.) I should add, this particular episode was written by Marti Noxon, but she and other writers admitted, that when fans came up to them and said that that was a really funny line, it was often Joss who inserted it there at the writer's table.
 
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monsterjazzlicks

Well-Known Member
Apr 10, 2017
65
234
Wirral, UK
Idiosyncrasy of the character of Oz in this case, (based on the originator/author in part, as most characters often are, Joss Whedon, a composer himself,) being, as he admitted, allergic to work of any kind, including more advanced forms of music, beyond the slacker rock his group, Dingoes Ate My Baby, already played. ("So I'll put off the more complicated stuff for another day, maybe forever, by tossing in an imaginary/non-chord in there," {in there, that is the conversation, not what he actually bothered to play on guitar} is what I believe is implied in this dialogue.) I should add, this particular episode was written by Marti Noxon, but she and other writers admitted, that when fans came up to them and said that that was a really funny line, it was often Joss who inserted it there at the writer's table.
Hi again,

Ok, fair enough; thanks.

I don't really understand much of this stuff but I appreciate the explanation. I think its all a bit beyond me to be honest! - but not to worry.

Continue to enjoy your music . . .

Ta,

Paul
 

Ebdim9th

Dressing the Gothic interval in tritones
Jul 1, 2009
6,132
22,082
And I will apply your opening of new vistas in theory to my playing. I only tried what I thought were Ebdim9th chords twice in all this time, and that was it, they just didn't apply to what I normally mess around with, even if it's something like Frank Gambale, or Allan Holdsworth. So enjoy, and play every monster jazz lick and lead you can whup out! Also, you seem to get the groove on the TV-writing stuff just fine. I got what you were saying ..... and now, back to our regularly scheduled exploration of Stephen's stories and hidden themes about getting lost .....
 

monsterjazzlicks

Well-Known Member
Apr 10, 2017
65
234
Wirral, UK
but about a Ghost Ship, I'm pretty sure I do, very atmospheric too, I'm not sure if its the same one though, it did have some deadly situations at hand, but see if this is it .... Watch Movie Ghost Ship (2002) Full
Hi Maddie,

I see 'Ghost Ship' is on Amazon Prime thanks so I will watch it on there.

btw - what is that website with the video link, and is it legal?

Many thanks,

Paul
 

Maddie

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
Jul 10, 2006
4,945
9,345
that dollhouse at the end of the street
quoting Paul here....

Hi Maddie,


I see 'Ghost Ship' is on Amazon Prime thanks so I will watch it on there.

btw - what is that website with the video link, and is it legal?

Many thanks,

Paul

hi Paul,

Ah that's a clever site if you can't
find it through the link to the movie itself. It hadn't been shut down that's really all I could tell you about it, that and most excellent quality , and quantity. : )

sincerely,

Maddie
 

Maddie

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
Jul 10, 2006
4,945
9,345
that dollhouse at the end of the street
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monsterjazzlicks

Well-Known Member
Apr 10, 2017
65
234
Wirral, UK
Thanks a lot Maddie,

In around the early 2000's, I saw, on UK TV, a film which was a little bit like a cross between 'Hansel & Gretal' and a vampire film. It was more spooky rather than horror.

From memory, I thought is was Christopher Walkden in it, but then I started thinking that it may be Willem DaFoe (they do have a slight passing resemblance in my eyes [if you know what I mean]!). There is nothing showing with Walkden in, and although DaFoe is listed as starring in one vampire film, it is definitely NOT that one.

Perhaps you have seen the one I am referring to here please . . .

Many thanks,

Paul
 

Maddie

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
Jul 10, 2006
4,945
9,345
that dollhouse at the end of the street
Thanks a lot Maddie,

In around the early 2000's, I saw, on UK TV, a film which was a little bit like a cross between 'Hansel & Gretal' and a vampire film. It was more spooky rather than horror.

From memory, I thought is was Christopher Walkden in it, but then I started thinking that it may be Willem DaFoe (they do have a slight passing resemblance in my eyes [if you know what I mean]!). There is nothing showing with Walkden in, and although DaFoe is listed as starring in one vampire film, it is definitely NOT that one.

Perhaps you have seen the one I am referring to here please . . .

Many thanks,

Paul

hi Paul ,

There are several that come to mind, I will check around for it, but this you might find interesting ... where it came from, is a mystery at the moment.


 
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Maddie

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
Jul 10, 2006
4,945
9,345
that dollhouse at the end of the street
hi Paul ,

There are several that come to mind, I will check around for it, but this you might find interesting ... where it came from, is a mystery at the moment.



Well, heres the entire movie from which that short footage came, its called 'The Addiction' which is a 1995 film starring Christopher Walken as a Vampire, though I don't believe this is what you are looking for, it is interesting fyi.

 
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